Child support reform? Not if it means custodial mothers receive less child support than they do now based on state child support guidelines. Not if it means children go without so Dad can have a better lifestyle.
If you are new to divorce let me explain how child support works. A parent pays child support based on guidelines set by the state the divorce takes place in. Those guidelines vary state to state so, check your state’s divorce laws for an accurate explanation of how your state decides how much a parent pays.
The one thing I can say, with all sincerity, is that child support guidelines are fair. No father is going broke due to a child support order. And, if he is, the courts have a solution for that, it’s called child support modification. He may go broke because he is in arrears…has not kept up with his child support and is having to pay the state back plus interest. If so, that is his problem, not his child’s problem and no child should have to pay for bad choices Dad made.
The internet is wrapped up with fathers complaining about paying “unreasonable” amounts of child support. According to Glenn Sacks, “A new study of child support has concluded that most states’ child support guidelines are poorly designed, inequitable, and in need of reform.”
After years of surviving on minimal child support and working with both mothers and fathers during and after divorce, I don’t see this as a clear case of injustice and inequality against fathers, the parent who is more likely to be ordered to pay child support. In fact, I don’t think that a sense of “injustice and inequality” have anything to do with fathers who resent paying child support.
I’m a single mother who provided for the majority of her children’s financial needs until they graduated from college. My ex-husband walked away from our marriage with 87% of his income and livid about paying the remaining 13% in child support. His complaint was, “how am I supposed to live?” My response, the one that finally left him stopped his complaints, “You’ll live a hell of a lot better lifestyle than your children.”
Here is the issue with men who complain about paying child support. It isn’t the amount of child support they pay; it’s having to pay it to the ex that gets under their skin. They can’t separate their relationship with the ex from the responsibility they have toward their children.
Should we reform child support laws just because some men are angry with their ex, no we shouldn’t. Loud, angry men are shouting over the heads of divorced moms who are raising and providing for their children. If we aren’t careful those men, those squeaky wheels will get the grease while our children suffer even more due to their mother’s inability to provide financially.
Do some research, you will find the justifications men use for believing child support should be reformed. Justifications like…
- Custodial mothers don’t have to provide receipts to non-custodial fathers that prove child support was spent on the child. Or, custodial mothers should provide for the children, share receipts of what was provided and then the non-custodial father can pay her back.
- It’s unconstitutional for the state to order a father to pay child support. It’s all about the 14th amendment. Paying child support deprives fathers of “life, liberty, or property without due process of law” as is accorded under the 14th amendment. I’m not sure how being ordered by a family court to pay child support can be misconstrued as not having due process. And, there seems to be no concern by these fathers of the “life, liberty, property and due process they would be denying their children by paying less child support.
- The worst comes from a woman, though. Phyllis Schlafly says, “The purpose of child support is to allow the mother to maintain a household and standard of living comparable to the father’s.” A woman who has spent decades fighting against equal rights for women lends her inexperienced voice to the topic of child support? She has no dog in the fight, has no idea what she is talking about and any argument from her holds no weight.
The child support system should be improved, not reformed to lower child support payments. In 2009, over $100 billion was owed in unpaid child support and nearly half of that to taxpayers supporting their children on public assistance. When custodial mothers don’t receive child support payments, they end up receiving public assistance. That public assistance costs the federal government around $53 billion a year.
The need isn’t to reduce what fathers owe their children financially. What we need is to reduce the burden on the federal government and custodial mothers due to fathers who don’t pay. Child support reform is a controversial subject. People have mixed feelings about the topic and I understand that. I don’t, however, understand how allowing fathers to become less responsible for their children will solve any problem, especially not the problem of a fair and equitable right our children have to be financially supported by both parents.
In the spirit of educating the readership of this site, many states now have a “payment support center” whereby you contact the state agency and have child support paid directly by the ex-spouses employer. Usually the service is free or super low cost (I think New Jersey charges a one-time $5 set up fee) No need to wait for a check and no battle. If the ex becomes unemployed, child support will be taken from the unemployment check. Another thing to note (but may not help Cathy in this case) is the guidlines are just that. Guidelines. They are not hard and fast numbers. So if you find yourself in the midst of a divorce, remember the child support guidelines are just a start. In many states they can be modified upward. Any requests to pay lower than the calcualted amount are usually not honored unless there is some good reason but I’ve never seen it.
In certain cases, the children’s curricular expenses are considered and factored into the support calculation (these are called Section 7 expenses in Canada) if they are ‘extraordinary’ expenses. For example, private school or extrememly expensive sports that the children have participated in historically. The idea is to not have one parent paying all of these expenses and allowing the children to continue in them. Great article, Cathy.
all you guys can do is point out singular situations. Fatheres take care of thier kids too . There are plenty of single fatheres out there and the number is increasing.There is no middle ground. I went to jail for 400 bucks of child support. we already get taxed. That is why there should be a middle ground. Half and half. That would solve everything.
I agree with you. Sing fathers and single mothers take a look at this and get a peace of mind and always have a attorney in your corner www.peaceofmindpro.us we are in all 50 states and Canada
You obviously have not a damn clue.
50/50 went into production of creating a life with out a sperm donor there would be no life. The law discriminates against fathers .The law doesn’t take into consideration of the facts during the court proceedings to award custody of the child to unwed mothers . The father provided the home the child resided in from date of birth and financial support and nurturing love for 4 and a half years , The woman took away the child right to have contact with his father and extended family on a daily basis How is the best interest of the child being served ? The child was not diagnosis with ADHD until court proceedings .
After 5 months of being no contact with his family ordered by his mother the child cannot be still the facial features have changed drastically . He now communicates as if a second person is speaking for the child .The judge didn’t give any consideration as to the effects of being drugged against the will of the child .
“Justice therefore dictates that if a woman makes a unilateral decision to bring pregnancy to term, and the biological father does not, and cannot, share in this decision, he should not be liable for 21 years of support. Or, put another way, autonomous women making independent decisions about their lives should not expect men to finance their choice.” — Karen DeCrow, former President of NOW
Bob, men have the same right to autonomy as women. They have the same right to make decisions about themselves. We all know that sexual intercourse can lead to pregnancy. A man can make a unilateral choice to not get a woman pregnant by refusing sexual intercourse except in situations where he knows he is protected from an unwanted pregnancy resulting from that intercourse. It is really quite simple. If you want to take away a woman’s ability to make unilateral decisions that will impact your life for 21 years then, as a man you must first make the unilateral decision to only engage and protected sex. And, that doesn’t mean, “she told me she was on the pill” protection. By condoms, by spermicide, by whatever is available over the counter to prevent pregnancy and if your sexual partner is not willing to use it, zip your pants and leave. Bottom line, stop blaming women for making decisions that impact your life if you yourself are not willing to make decisions that impact your life. This baby making thing is a two way street.
As men we have to take our message to the state leg, some of us can’t afford to pay. My child support order is 98% of my take home check. My ex wife has a salary five times what I make. We need a system which is reasonable and fair. Not being a PHD I’m not sure what it is, as fathers we have to lobby for change and try to get people to understand what’s going on and devise a system that helps us and does not leave children behind. Sometimes society should understand that he needs the money more than she does.
“Sometimes society should understand that he needs the money more than she does.”
Jason, it isn’t about her or him needing the money. It is about being responsible as a parent. Responsible parents help with the financial, emotional and physical needs of their children. One parent making more than the other doesn’t negate the fact that both parents are responsible. This isn’t a her against him issue and when men start making it about their children instead of their ex-wives things may begin to change.
“It is about being responsible as a parent.” What does that phrase even mean? This is a philosophical argument. I get it, you hate the fact that there are men who are crappy fathers. But guess what, some men are just like that. You’ve got some guy who has ADHD and an IQ of 85. He will never be a “responsible father” by middle class standards. He’s going to work for a little while, get fired, maybe work again, get fired again. He’s so broke that the gas money to see his kids isn’t really worth it. And when he does have money to see his kids, its probably because he’s freeloading off a woman who wants to be a step mom. If his ex is financially successful, I stand by what I said, she should cut him a break. And if she doesn’t, that’s ok, but thank God men like this have people who will treat him with dignity and understanding and not shame him. Life sucks. Men like this will often spend time in jail, and I think that’s cruel and barbaric, but its not the end of the world. As long as there are lots of people who will give these kinds of men tolerance and understanding, they will be ok. Happy Valentines Day to all the women who have loved crappy fathers.
Jason, a question for you. In 2012, 30.4% of custodial mothers and their children lived in poverty. Who do they have to treat them with dignity and understanding? Life does suck, especially if you are a child living in poverty and a mother trying to feed and clothe that child. Here is the difference between the mother who is trying to feed and clothe her children and the guy with ADHD and an IQ of 85…she has no way out of her responsibility to her children but you want to give the father of those children a break? 76% of custodial mothers are gainfully employed, 85.1% of non-custodial fathers are gainfully employed. And when I use the word “gainfully” I mean they are earning something other than minimum wage. According to statistics non-custodial fathers are in a far better financial position that custodial mothers. And why should we have across the board child support reform just because some men can’t pay? Why isn’t our concern for all those children living in poverty instead of some men who can’t pay? I’m inclined to be more likely to give an kid a break than I am an adult.
Do you feel there is = justic in America? or is this all about bashing one side or there other? please visit my site. I feel as a independent associate of this company there is finally a company that cares about every ones rights not just one side. = justice means the world to a lot of us. www.peaceofmindpro.us
Another point here: maybe child support SHOULD be unfair. When you know your wages are being garnished, you don’t want to work. Maybe I am a selfish guy who doesn’t want to provide for my kids, so what. The child support system should produce the best outcomes for children not try to be fair. If you garnish 70% of my income I don’t want to work, if you allow me to pay 10% of my income I might get a job. And if 10% is better than nothing maybe child suppor should be lowered. You have to think about that stuff.
“Maybe I am a selfish guy who doesn’t want to provide for my kids, so what.”
That may be the most honest thing I’ve heard a man say in response to the argument over unfair child support laws. And, it says it all. It is especially indicative of why we need child support laws that protect the children, not the paying parent.
“child support laws that protect the children, not the paying parent.” No – we need laws that protect both. In this country rapists and murders get due process but it seems few want to give that to those accused of being deadbeat dads. I am proud to fight for all men labeled deadbeat dads throughout the land. Its a mark of character to fight for the lowest of the low, as the ACLU does. Today judges in Minnesota helped a man with over 80,000 in arrears. Thank goodness for sane judges! If you are struggling with child support, join the struggle and lets make our voice heard, there are 25 million of us, we are more numerous than the number Jewish American, than the number or gays and lesbians, more numerous than all the men in prison. Lets make a difference. Here’s the link on the Minnesota man who won’t be in a cold prison:
http://www.startribune.com/local/245304681.html
X
I’m curious, what did those judges do for the mother owed child support and the children dependent on it? And, are you seriously proud that the number of “deadbeat” dads is so high? There are 25 million of you? And how many children are out there with no one to depend on but a mother because of you 25 million?
I see a fair share of deadbeat moms. I have 50/50 custody of my two daughters yet I pay $1500/ month, that’s 33% of my take home pay. What about all that “it’s both parent’s responsibility” stuff you were talking about and how it shouldn’t matter if a woman has a higher income? In my case the support award most definitely supports her lifestyle. Give dad’s half custody and eliminate child support, restrict support to 5 years in shared custody scenarios. Why doesn’t an obligee have to repay an obligor in shared custody situations?
Glen, it is both parent’s responsibility. It’s their responsibility to pay and care for their children to the best of the ability based on their income. You evidently have a much higher income than the mother of your children which is why you pay $1500 a month. Your argument to give Dads half custody and eliminate child support doesn’t’ hold water…not for a man who loves his children anyway. You aren’t supporting her lifestyle, you are supporting your children’s lifestyle. I guess it could be done the way you suggest if you don’t care how your children live when they are not in your custody. And, it sounds like you don’t. It’s no skin off your back if they live in a dump, wear second hand clothes and have little to eat when with Mom as long as you get to keep some more of your income. And, this 5 year elimination of child support. If a child is 5 when Mom and Dad divorce, you want Dad’s financial responsibility to end when the child is 10? You can’t have it both ways, you can’t insist that you pay child support based on the difference in income and then you stop paying after 5 years. Your thinking is convoluted. According to your plan divorced Mothers would share the major portion of the expense of raising children. I’m thinking that would be OK with you as long as you get to keep more of your income. Oh, wait, I’ve already said that about you, haven’t I? Sorry, repeating myself. And, another thing, if you are paying 33% of your income in child support that means you are left with what, $4,000 a month to live on. Seriously? You can’t manage to live and be satisfied on 67% of your income while your children are having to manage on only 33%? Get on with your bad self Buddy. Stop whining and move on.
Cathy, you’re obviously in the tank for divorced mothers no matter the situation. You have advocated for fathers to pay mothers when the mother’s income is 3 times that of the father, why won’t you advocate for that father to have shared custody and receive support from the mother? Hmm? In my case, my ex-spouse works under the table and takes home about $2,500 a month, tax free mind you. She owns a very nice townhouse that was built in 2016, paid for in part by the $1500 I give her every month. Why am I not entitled to a fair share of the equity in this home? I take care of my daughters half the time, and I would happily take the full-time, however, I actually do believe that having both parents in a child’s life is in the best interest of the child. Every other weekend parents have essentially been removed as major role model to their children. So, again I ask, why don’t I receive a portion of the equity in the home she has bought? She has the same purchasing power as I do, $2,500 + $1,500= $4,000. However, my ex-spouse enjoys doing nails for a living so she can hide income from the courts, meanwhile I work at an underground gold mine working my tail off in addition to putting up with an ever-growing number of unpleasant supervisors and colleagues. I work shift work, while she is sleeping in the dead of winter, I’m chipping ice 16″ thick from the walls of a ventilation shaft on top of a hoist conveyance, risking my life in single digit weather on a good night, -15 degrees on a those nights that aren’t so pleasant. You think it is totally okay because now our children live in homes that have equalized the income between them? Give me a break. Yes, $4,000 a month is plenty to survive on, but it’s not as if I am living a life of luxury. More importantly, I am obviously carrying a much larger load than my ex. She too could work at a mine in our county and make the same amount of money that I do, or much closer to it than she does now, but she chooses not to do so. She doesn’t want to get up at 3am, or work a 12 hour shift and drive an hour each way to work to do so. My child support amount could easily be reduced by $500 and my children would be just fine. You said it best when you said that both parents have a responsibility to support their children to the best of their ability. My ex is not trying her best, she is enjoying a low stress career doing nails at my expense because she knows she can. The system is broken. I have yet to read you support a man in ANY situation whatsoever. Your ad hominem attacks do nothing to sway me either. My ex has tried her best to ruin my reputation spreading lies, creating spoofed text messages to show mutual friends to try and sway their opinion about me, as well as accuse me of abusing my children to no avail. My children love me and I them, we have an incredibly strong and loving relationship that enrages my ex for some reason. There are just as many terrible moms out there as there are terrible dads, conversely the same is true for good moms and dads. Your inability to recognize this exposes your strong bias and leads me to suspect that your intentions are purely monetary in nature.
Glen, I support PARENTS paying child support, not just fathers. Regardless of how much money a parent makes that parent is going to end up being financially responsible, in some way for their children. If your ex made 3 times the income you do, in the eyes of the courts, you would still be responsible for helping to financially support your children. How can you not understand the logic and morality of that? As for you getting equity in her home, it’s her home, not your home. Once the money leaves your pocket and hits her pocket, it becomes HER money. She isn’t spending YOUR money, she is spending HER money. It may piss you off that you have to provide her with money but you do and when you do it becomes HER money. As for her working conditions compared to your working conditions, that is just plain childish. She doesn’t deserve child support because she doesn’t work in a mine? She isn’t trying her best because she isn’t working a job that has your stamp of approval? Are you that big of a control freak? It sounds as if it is you that is enraged, Glen. That anger at your ex will one day impact your relationship with your children if you aren’t careful. I’m done here. Cathy Meyer
” And why should we have across the board child support reform just because some men can’t pay? Why isn’t our concern for all those children living in poverty instead of some men who can’t pay? I’m inclined to be more likely to give an kid a break than I am an adult.” These are actually some very good questions. ‘Accross the board reform’ is not really a big priority for me as an activist – I mainly identify with poor fathers. Without making a long list, I think you need a broad amount of interventions to help the economic wellbeing of
poor noncustodial fathers(example – Obama wanted to allow poor NC fathers who are current on child support to get EITC money). I also envision creating a more significant type of due process for fathers facing jail to distinguish between fathers who can’t pay and those who don’t want to. To put it crudely, you have to understand the child support system as basically a system punishing poor men for reproducing. The aim of child support enforcement against low income men is not to help poor children, but really middle class society’s way of saying they wish these children had never been born in the first place. Which is almost fair, if you’re talking about men with 6 baby mommas, but not men with two children. I think when you frame it like this, feminists will be enormously sympathetic to poor fathers because they will see this part of child support enforcement as part of a broader dehumanization and harrassment of the poor.
This is a seriously flawed article. The child support laws in our country are fundamentally unjust in several ways, and it has nothing to do with men wanting less resposibility.
a) The way the laws are framed, non-custodial parents are treated, from the very first court notice, as potential criminals. “You failure to appear will result in your arrest.” The assumption here is that fathers, once they no longer live with the children’s mother, won’t want to provide for their children, unless otherwise compelled by the courts.
We justify this attitude by declaring that the father must be held responsible for providing for his children. But the child has TWO parents, so what’s the mother’s responsibility? The answer, of course, is that she will raise them and care for them.
So let’s take a look at how this balances out.
Father’s responsibility: paying money.
Mother’s responsibility: To raise and care for the child.
This is hardly a balanced arrangement. While the father’s part is purely *responsibility*, the mother’s part is in fact a *privilege.*
Look at the facts: Child support and custody are ENTIRELY different kinds of roles.
No one fights for the “privilege” of paying child support, but many fight for the privilege of custody.
Fathers are forced to pay child support, but mothers are never forced to take custody.
If a mother is unfit to parent, her children might be taken from her. But she does NOT get put in jail for it. But we drag fathers to court to uphold their responsibilty, and put them in jail if they fail to do so.
And so this hogwash of “father’s must live up to their obligations” must end. The father’s obligations are entirely unequal to the mother’s.
Custodial parents (usually mothers) have the tremendous fortune of having their children as a constant presence in their lives. They chose to have them, and to raise and care for them, and they got exactly what they wanted.
The men, too, chose to have these children, and to raise and care for them, but they’re NOT getting that. They are reduced to “visitors,” and have to fight tooth and nail against mothers who often seek to keep fathers away out of spite.
b) We fail to take into account that poverty is a fact of life. We don’t drag all poor men into court–only those who have had the misfortune of getting on the mother’s bad side. Layoffs, unemployment, and poverty exist for for married and divorced alike. If a married couple falls on hard times, we don’t drag the father to court over not providing for his family. We understand that parents do the best they can. But once a couple splits, we then allow a mother’s sense of entitlement to turn a father into a near-criminal, punish him for his poverty, prevent him from getting ahead and improving his situation, simply because he had the misfortune to get into a bad situation in the first place.
I know all this firsthand. A year after my divorce, I got laid off, as part of the economic downturn in 2008. Until then, I had paid every cent in child support as ordered–even as my ex turned my two children against me, and they refused to see me. Once I got laid off, I could no longer pay, but the judge would not modify the order, as she believed I could easily get another job. I couldn’t. The industry I was in had laid off hundreds of thousands across the county, and I simply could not get hired. After losing my wife and family, I now lost my employment, and soon after, my home, and my car. I fell into severe depression, became suicidal, was hospitalized for a time. I then spent three years of homelessness, all the while the arrears kept piling up because I couldn’t afford a lawyer to keep fighting it. When I finally figured out how to fight it on my own, I was already tens of thousands deep in arrears.
Now, I am unable to get up from this situation. Whenever I find work and get even a small amount into my bank account, it gets taken because of the child support liens. This means that even when I do work, I still cannot get food or a roof over my head. I cannot afford proper clothes to wear to an interview, or the transportation costs of getting there.
I have learned by now that this is not an isolated incident; there are thousands of men in similar situations, stuck at the bottom because of unfortunate circumstances and a cruel legal system that cannot get past the idea of men as shirkers of responsibility.
But none of this even compares to the pain of being unable to have my children in my lives. I may not be able to afford much, but if I had the option of seeing them, I would travel by foot for miles, just for the opportunity to see and speak to them. But their mother, who received full custody, quickly turned them hostile–all the while the court stood by and wouldn’t do anything about it.
This, to me, is evil. And this is why any right-thinking person understands that child support AND custody laws MUST be reformed.
The only way to address this fundamental evil, is to enforce a strict and inviolable right to joint custody and joint support, fully 50/50 of all responsibilities and all privileges. This will keep children in both parents’ lives, who will provide for the children during their time in the same way that each parent provides for himself–whether its in luxury or in poverty.
The ONLY time a government can morally and ethically force a child support judgment is when one parent voluntarily gives up his or her custodial rights. That, rightfully, should incur a penalty of having to pay not only for the child’s needs but also for the custodial parent’s time/energy in doing his job for him.
Of course, it is understandable that mothers–who are quite happy with the current bias in their favor, thank you very much–will resist this. But those who do this, show only their own lack of moral character by failing to recognize that both father and child need each other in ways that go far beyond financial support. The fact that this inconveniences HER and so she cannot conceive of such an arrangement as fair–THAT is the real and true problem.
I am a working dad that is married. I was 17 when I had my first kid. i was 19 when I had my second. I was stupid and even though I wasnt ready for the responsibility, I still tried. My baby mam’s mad it difficult and only went to get child support because they were mad at me. They had family just like I did. And my kids were always welcome to stay at my house or my families. I owe 14,000 and then the government added 2000 for “interest”. I had no job, went through recession and everthing. They put me in jail over 400 dollars of child support. If my taxes pay for welfare, why the fuck do I have to pay again with child support. Why are mothers not forced to go to work and make a living just like a dad? Why is it not split down the middle? half and half. Who cares who the custodial parent is? The fact is, that is still both parents child and its none of the governments business. Alll of these young men that would have been successful or could have come back on top of things cant because of years of owed child support. The system is not fair. If the woman didnt want to have the baby or this responsibility then she should have never had the baby. Yeah it takes 2 to take a baby, but its ultimately the mother’s decision. Our ancestors didnt have child support. We are only teaching kids and women to lean onthe government instead of figuring things out. Ive been homeless, without food, without a dad everything. I have been through it all. That child support did nothing for us. i would take my dad being around over the child support anyday. YOu wanna say guys should be okay iwth 98 or 50% of their pay check being taken. If the kid was with the dad, there is no way a dad would spend 50 to 90% of their paycheck every week for a kid. I am married with a 11 month old, and I dont do that. THis hwole system is unfair and bullshit. A custodial parent and anon custodial parent should bear the same burden. If the non custodial parent doesnt have money to get a 2 or 3 bed room then help them. Give them the tools needed to be a parent. If they cant pay, so what. if the kid is not straving or if nothing is wrong leave it alone. Dont charge interest. Checks should be done on both sides
I am a woman and cant believe how ignorant your post is Cathy. Not every man is in the same financial situation. You want to sit here and talk about how, and I quote, “No father is going broke due to a child support order”. Where is your reasearch to support this? I can one hundred percent assure you this is not correct. A father should not have to send the rest of his life in poverty because of a failed relationship. A father has the right to be happy just the same as a mother does. A father has the right to build a new life. When a father builds a new life, with a new wife and children what then? What will you say to the children of the fathers new relationship? Will you tell them that they deserve to live in pverty because of their fathers previous failed relationship? You claim to care so much about the welfare of the children but how much do you truely care. My husband was charged $900 a month off a $13 an hour income. How is this ok when he is also trying to support his wife and two kids. CHILD SUPPORT NEEDS REFORM! How is it fair that the mother gets to take a majority of a mans income plus she usually has her own income and then that a her new bofriend/huband? This is not ok…my children should not have to live in poverty because of greed. Get your facts straight and do some research before you open your mouth and insert your foot in it again. Wake up to reality the world we live in is not black and white.
Nicole, every man may not be in the same financial situation but every child is. That is the bottom line, the child’s situation, not the fathers. You have turned this into an argument about mother and father and totally missed the point. You mention him, his ex, you and your children but at no time do you mention his children. The children he is financially responsible for. I agree that fathers have a right to build new lives with new wives and new children. That doesn’t negate the responsibility he has to any previous children. If your children are living in proverty it isn’t due to his previous failed relationship. It is due to the responsibility he has for his previous children and nothing at all to do with their mother. Your children’s need do not trump his other children’s needs!
As for your husband being ordered to pay $900 a month on a salary of $13 an hour, that can’t be correct. Child support is calculated in percentages. The highest percentage any state requires is 28% which, based on your husband’s salary is not $900 a month. If he was ordered to pay $900 a month it is because he had child support arrears that were tacked onto state guidelines for child support. And, if your husband earns $13 an hour, $900 is not the “majority” of his income.
This isn’t about greed. This is the bottom line…if you are a woman who is marrying a man who pays child support it is in your best interest to weigh the impact to children you have with that man. If you choose to have children with that man and those children have to do without because he pays child support then the responsiblity lies with you and your husband, not his previous relationship or the children from that relationship.
I want a new car. I can’t afford a new car. If I went out and purchased a new car which resulted in me not being able to pay my bills who’s fault would that be? The person who sold me the new car or, me for choosing to buy a car I can’t afford?
Again Cathy do your research. Child support does need reform. Our own President believes this. Guidelines, you must not be that familar with the Child Support System, guidelines are often just a word used and not followed in the Child Support system. I am very aware of what my husband pays for child support and the amount does not include arrears. One child should never have to suffer for another and I am not just speaking of my own children. I believe that the children in all relationships should be taken into account. NO ONE should be put into poverty over child support and this is often the case…AGAIN DO YOUR RESEARCH. A woman should not reap the benefits of her new bofriend/husbands income, her income, and still be able to put her ex, child’s father into poverty because of greed. Should the father pay child suport…YES…should he pay so much that he is put into the poverty level…NO! Please go back to school and re-educate yourself about what is really going on in the world. Child support should not be based on GROSS income (but it is), it should not accrue interest (but it does), Someone should not be put into jail for not paying (yet they are while it continues to accrue and not be paid…how does this help anyone?). Debtors prison was outlawed long ago…so how is it that they are allowing people to be thrown into jail for not paying child suport…seems like a contradiction. Suspending someones drivers license will only make it more difficult to go to work and make money to pay child support so how does this benefit anyone. I say again child suport needs reform. There are better ways to get someone to pay child support. I can give you a few right now…instead of using tax dollars to jail someone for debt why not put the that money to use by offering help to find employment, educational opportunities to improve ones occupational outlook, and debt counciling to increase ones efficiency at managing income. These are only a few of the ideas that I have I am sure there are more proactive ones available from the people of the world. Our tax dollars need to go to programs that are going to help increase the likelyhood of child suport payment not decrease it. Jail should be held for serious criminals like murders and rapists not those deliquent on child support. Cathy if you feel it is my fault for marrying my husband whom had children prior to our meeting then are you not being hypocritical? May be you should have chosen a better man to have children with then and you would not be seeking child support…this is basically the same thing you are saying to me. Most people deserve a second chance…even you do. I hope that you were not judged for having children from another marriage by a man like you have judged me for marrying my husband whom had children by another woman. I love my husbands children and they are taking care of and get all of their needs met and almost all of their “WANTS” met. My children get their needs met and we have a difficult time doing this…it is not fair nor should it be acceptable. One set of children should not get IPhones, xboxes, etc. while the others lack the neccesities of everyday life…
Again Cathy do your research. Child support does need reform. Our own President believes this. Guidelines, you must not be that familar with the Child Support System, guidelines are often just a word used and not followed in the Child Support system. I am very aware of what my husband pays for child support and the amount does not include arrears. One child should never have to suffer for another and I am not just speaking of my own children. I believe that the children in all relationships should be taken into account. NO ONE should be put into poverty over child support and this is often the case…AGAIN DO YOUR RESEARCH. A woman should not reap the benefits of her new bofriend/husbands income, her income, and still be able to put her ex, child’s father into poverty because of greed. Should the father pay child suport…YES…should he pay so much that he is put into the poverty level…NO! Please go back to school and re-educate yourself about what is really going on in the world. Child support should not be based on GROSS income (but it is), it should not accrue interest (but it does), Someone should not be put into jail for not paying (yet they are while it continues to accrue and not be paid…how does this help anyone?). Debtors prison was outlawed long ago…so how is it that they are allowing people to be thrown into jail for not paying child suport…seems like a contradiction. Suspending someones drivers license will only make it more difficult to go to work and make money to pay child support so how does this benefit anyone. I say again child suport needs reform. There are better ways to get someone to pay child support. I can give you a few right now…instead of using tax dollars to jail someone for debt why not put the that money to use by offering help to find employment, educational opportunities to improve ones occupational outlook, and debt counciling to increase ones efficiency at managing income. These are only a few of the ideas that I have I am sure there are more proactive ones available from the people of the world. Our tax dollars need to go to programs that are going to help increase the likelyhood of child suport payment not decrease it. Jail should be held for serious criminals like murders and rapists not those deliquent on child support. Cathy if you feel it is my fault for marrying my husband whom had children prior to our meeting then are you are being hypocritical? May be you should have chosen a better man to have children with then and you would not be seeking child support…this is basically the same thing you are saying to me. Most people deserve a second chance…even you do. I hope that you were not judged for having children from another marriage by a man like you have judged me for marrying my husband whom had children by another woman. I love my husbands children and they are taking care of and get all of their needs met and almost all of their “WANTS” met. My children get their needs met and we have a difficult time doing this…it is not fair nor should it be acceptable. One set of children should not get IPhones, xboxes, etc. while the others lack the neccesities of everyday life…
Cathy,
I think its funny how everyone can’t see through the forest to see a tree here and the reality of child support in this country.
First of all, this is an industry that employs thousands of social workers, judges, therapists and court rooms filled with people who all earn a living doing so. How could that be that these people can earn a living. Who pays them? Can it be the poor man they took the children away from for no reason to support their agenda? No. It’s the taxpayer baby!!
What’s really funny is that the taxpayer believes that these men are deadbeat dads when they were denied they rights to be a father in the first place. Yea, I understand every situation is different but the reality is that all men are treated as sperm donars and wage earners and not fathers in the courts.
So, what is this doing to our children? Our society? Our future? I think that we shall see what these children turn out like with hatred towards a father that was good and loving and could have provided guidance to help them form positive lives. Yes, society will carry this burden until the inequaility in the court rooms changes and allows children to have a father too.
Cathy, if you really care about these children maybe you should write about reform in the courts allowing 50/50 custody for fathers that want to be fathers! Do something positive for children other than scapegoating fathers as deadbeat dads!
Kevin, I think you are the one failing to “see the forest.” There is an “industry” because there is a need. Why? Because of parents who are ordered to pay child support and don’t pay. The agenda is to make sure our children are provided for and as a tax payer I’m more than happy to support those who work in that industry.
I would like to ask you what child custody has to do with child support. They are too different issues. Being ordered to pay child support doesn’t take away any parent’s right to continue to be a parent. In fact, in my opinion, paying child support is an act of parenting. Something any parent should voluntarily want to do but, due to the lack of desire to do so by some parents, we have a much needed “industry” to force those parents to do what should come naturally.
The courts don’t treat men as sperm donors and wage earners. They treat men like FATHERS who have a responsibility toward their children. If that makes you feel like a sperm donor and wage earner that is an issue you should take up with a good therapist.
I have two children that I supported in every way throughout their childhood. No one had to force me to do that and not once did I feel like an egg donor and a wage earner. I felt like a mother doing the right thing by her children.
And, if some children grow to hate their fathers due to watching their mothers struggle to hold things together financially, that isn’t a societal issue, something you can lay at the feet of everyone except the father who left them to struggle financially. Fathers are good, supportive, provide guidance AND financial support, Kevin. The only person who will carry the burden of angry children is the father who didn’t understand it was his responsibility to provide for his child in EVERY way.
Again, you are muddying the waters by making child custody and child support one issue. Shared or 50/50 custody doesn’t do away with the need for child support. It doesn’t do away with the need for a father or mother to help provide for their child. In a 50/50 custody arrangement the parent with the larger income is still going to be order to pay child support. As far as my beliefs…50/50 custody should be the starting point in any custody negotiation. It should be the standard unless a couple agrees on something different. A child should have the right to equal time with both parents AND he/she should have two parents’ willingness to financially and emotionally provide.
Kevin, fathers who want to be fathers find a way to be fathers. Fathers who want to be fathers don’t get caught up in an “industry” created to make sure parents pay child support. It is that simple.
Child support salaries are paid under title 4 D of the social security code. From the administrators to the quasi judges. Which is money collected by those paying child support through grants from the feds. It’s a fraudulent system.
But, Steve, if fathers paid the child support they are ordered to pay, there would be no need for child support enforcement workers. If you don’t want part of your child support taken to pay those who have to work hard to collect it from you, pay your child support as ordered.
Oh Cathy, I forgot to mention that I am a proud deadbeat dad who had his rights denied and I enjoy going to court and watching all these people mill around at the tax payers expense.
By the way, there really pissed off because all my wealth is protected in a inheritance trust that contains 45 million that was going to go to the children but now is mine. Happy trails!
And there you have it, the truth. You made a choice, your money or your children. You chose what was most important to you…your money. It would seem, based on your comments that money really can’t buy happiness.
And there you have it, the truth. You made a choice, your money or your children. You chose what was most important to you…your money. It would seem, based on your comments that money really can’t buy happiness.
And there you have it, the truth. You made a choice, your money or your children. You chose what was most important to you…your money. It would seem, based on your comments that money really can’t buy happiness.
And there you have it, the truth. You made a choice, your money or your children. You chose what was most important to you…your money. It would seem, based on your comments that money really can’t buy happiness.
You are now free to ride off into the sunset. I’m left wondering why you don’t.
Kevin, I think you are the one failing to “see the forest.” There is an “industry” because there is a need. Why? Because of parents who are ordered to pay child support and don’t pay. The agenda is to make sure our children are provided for and as a tax payer I’m more than happy to support those who work in that industry.
I would like to ask you what child custody has to do with child support? They are too different issues. Being ordered to pay child support doesn’t take away any parent’s right to continue to be a parent. In fact, in my opinion, paying child support is an act of parenting. Something any parent should voluntarily want to do but, due to the lack of desire to do so by some parents, we have a much needed “industry” to force those parents to do what should come natually.
The courts don’t treat men as sperm donors and wage earners. They treat men like FATHERS who have a responsibility toward their children. If that makes you feel like a sperm donor and wage earner that is an issue you should take up with a good therapist.
I have two children that I supported in every way throughout their childhood. No one had to force me to do that and not once did I feel like an egg donor and a wage earner. I felt like a mother doing the right thing by her children.
And, if some children grow to hate their fathers due to watching their mothers struggle to hold things together financially, that isn’t a societal issue, something you can lay at the feet of everyone except the father who left them to struggle financially. Fathers are good, supportive, provide guidance AND financial support, Kevin. The only person who will carry the burden of angry children is the father who didn’t understand it was his responsibility to provide for his child in EVERY way.
Again, you are muddying the waters by making child custody and child support one issue. Shared or 50/50 custody does’t do away with the need for child support. It doesn’t do away with the need for a father or mother to help provide for their child. In a 50/50 custody arrangement the parent with the larger income is still going to be order to pay child support. As far as my beliefs…50/50 custody should be the starting point in any custody negotiation. It should be the standard unless a couple agrees on something different. A child should have the right to equal time with both parents AND he/she should have two parents willings to financially and emotionally provide.
Kevin, fathers who want to be fathers find a way to be fathers. Fathers who want to be fathers don’t get caught up in an “industry” created to make sure parents pay child support. It is that simple.
Cathy, I’m sorry but you really are missing the truth here!
You have no understanding of my case and my commitment to my children but you act like you have complete understanding? Your not going to answer the wrong doings of a court system that your not part of by generalizing the system as a whole.
Fact is, the system failed my children and their own attorney is going to court to say so next month. I have challenged Department of child support services 3 times in state hearings and won each time. The state of California has given me back $17,000 in overpayment because the courts have failed to allow me to defend my rights regarding disposable income versus gross income. The judges have tried to squeeze me to get to the money but haven’t followed the law.
I will not support inequality in the system!!! If my sons grow up to hate me, well I will move on but I will not have my feelings held hostage or pay a ransom.
It would do your readers good to know that you are open and willing to hear others and their struggles for equality in the legal system. It’s not your way or the highway here on the intenet. Everyone has another channel to tune into once this one gets old.
Open your mind, and know that there is more to hear than there is to speak. Just a suggestion:)
Good luck and I hope you can really make a differance for those fathers that struggle.
With Equal rights comes equal responsibility. I don’t understand why you would be so resistent to provideing receipts when a man is in jeopardy of going to jail if he misses a payment: an arbitrary payment made up to fork over to a financial rapist. You are not ENTITLED to someone else’s income. Let the child live with the father if you can’ t afford the care. I have kids and I pay for them, because it was my CHOICE to have them. Women are the only ones who can choose to give birth leave a kid at the hospital or put the kid up ofr adioption with no legal repercussions. And yes, jailing someone and revoking license because he cannot pay another grown woman is loss of liberty. Since you’re so mature about it, why not fork over your income to your ex and allow him to pay for all of the kids expenses…… since its only about the kids. Stop all the “I’m Owed his money” Garbage. Woman up and take responsibility for your own choices. With every finger pointed there are four pointing back at you.
Everyone wants free money. Its convenient to pretend that someone else who is trying to naviage through life “owes” you. Why not go back to school and make better choices for yourself. Oh, because the child support check would be cut. Good job Cathy.
FAMILY LAW REFORM NOV 15-16TH . DIVORCECORP.COM
Why don’t you mention dead beat moms? I am a divorced dad that has 100% custody of three children and I get almost nothing. I have to subtract 10% of the spousal support I give her as that is the amount she owes in child support, 1/10th of what I pay her. When spousal is due to end, I will get nothing. She hasn’t paid for a single dollar of court ordered bills since the divorce, such as braces, doctor bills or schooling etc. I even had to pay for her lawyer and half of her supervised visits. She keeps dragging me back to court every other month for more spousal support and doesn’t even show up to court herself. She is allowed to abuse the court system in was no man could! I also see other single dads in similar situations and the women they deal with seem to get away with actions so heinous, any man doing those things would be locked away for sure. Simply put, the courts seem to be reluctant to go after dead beat moms. I can’t help but think that if I was the woman and she was the man, things would be different. Still, I love my children and would not trade positions with any of the men in this forum that “appear” to be getting a raw deal. Having the children 100% is such a blessing, I don’t want to risk the alternative.
To be completely honest, I joined your site as a dad because I am in the same boat as many of moms and I hope you don’t revoke my account after receiving this post. Just acknowledge that which camp you may find yourself, is not a function of your gender.
Good to see this lively conversation continues. I stand by the basic point, we need “targeted” reform for men who can’t afford to pay so they shouldn’t lose their rights or become homeless. But we also need some consideration for middle class men with middle class wives: SHE gets the benefit of seeing the child so SHE should have to sacrifice more. Meaning if both parents are middle class, Dad should have more money to go to a Kenny Rogers concert, since SHE is the one who gets the relationship with the child. How we should work this out as far as a formula I don’t know, but this is an often neglected part of social justice that needs to be considered.
The child support laws aboslutely need reform. One equation does not fit all scenarios. Consider this. I have joint legal and physical custody of my 2 children. I usually have them a little more than 50% of the time. I plan my life and my schedule around my children – which is how it should be and happily do so. Holidays, vacations, sports are all done as a family. I pay 100% of health care. I buy clothes, books, toys etc. and enusre the children have an equal distibution of such between both households. I ended up divorced because my wife of 15 years decided to have an affair and then left me to be with this other person.
When she left she left 100% debt free, and with a new car. I kept our family house and the tradition and comfort it provided for my children. I kept our routines, our rituals our life. She left. Now, becuase I have much higher income on paper, I am expected to pay child support to her so she can support a ‘new’ life in which she chose. This is absurd. I understand the need to protect equality of living standards, and I go out of my way to do so. I also understand the importance of emotional health that comes along with positive parental relationships. But the law is structured as such that the responsible father, or higher income earner, is penalized for the choices of the other half. The other half is rewarded for irresponsible behavior. This is the example and lessons we are teaching our children and possibly a contributor is the high divorce rate. In this case, the ex-wife executed ‘breach’ of contract through marital infidelity and get’s rewarded for such behavior.
Sorry, this is not ‘just’ nor ‘fair’. I would much rather see reform that does not support irresponsible behavior. I would be much rather put this child support check directly into a collage trust for my children.
Please, in your analysis do not sterotype all dad’s into one catagory. The real dads, the modern dads, are more involved, more attentative, more responsible that those you write about.
Yeah… I’m dumping my thoughts 🙂 kinda wordy I know but I’m not into tweets.
“It’s unconstitutional for the state to order a father to pay child support. It’s all about the 14th amendment. Paying child support deprives fathers of “life, liberty, or property without due process of law” as is accorded under the 14th amendment. I’m not sure how being ordered by a family court to pay child support can be misconstrued as not having due process.”
It’s unconstitutional in most divorces, in my view, because the parent deprived of their property has not been convicted of a crime. As such, if the government takes a persons private property, when that person has not been convicted of a crime. That person must be compensated by the government.
A union between two willing people constitutes a contract. A verbal, consensual agreement. Unless there is a written contract prior to their union, or a contract after their union ends. Natural Law is the law of our land.
Natural Law simple states… You Receive the Benefit. You Bear the Burden. Unless there is Contract Law between two consenting adults, neither of which is under duress, then our Country is bound to honor Natural Law and our representatives swore to do just that.
So let’s look at the 14th Amendment
Article [V]
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
http://constitutionus.com/
You cite due process… but due process must adhere to the whole of the U.S. Constitution… nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
The Best Interest Doctrine IS indeed a public use doctrine.
Therefor, if the courts are going to decided who gets our blood property, and no one has been convicted of a crime. The person deprived of their blood property must be compensated.
As for shared custody.
There is no way to have time-sharing or shared custody in divorce without depriving on parent of their liberty to have unfettered access to their blood property. To do so without compensating that individual is criminal, because it’s unconstitutional. Unless both parties agree in writing i.e. contract to do so. But, both parties must be free of duress when entering said agreement.
Men in general are under duress. In 85%+ of the cases. Women receive custodial rights. Whether the man was convicted of a crime or not. Whether the man broke the Natural Law agreement of their union.
Then, these same men are not only deprived of their blood property but also their income property.
To create laws that violate The Laws of Nature i.e. the right to have posterity by a shared, consensual union between a man and a woman puts individuals under duress.
In the case of marriage. A woman who wants a divorce has the right to do so. But, unless her man is convicted of a crime or breach of contract. She does not have the right to take or deprive him of his blood property or income property. She does have the liberty to live, to work and to pursue her happiness.
This also holds true for our children.
Our children have the right to life, whereby they may grow into their liberty i.e. adulthood, whereby they may pursue happiness. No person has the right to harm these fundamental rights of a child.
What we gain today in terms of “winning” the benefit without bearing the burden. Only pushes the burden we did not bear onto future generations i.e. our children. Our grandchildren.
Think about our daughters. When men win their children back, as it was in earlier times. Your daughters, our daughters, will loose their children and pay to support them. They will loose, through no fault of their own, unfettered access to their children. They will loose the benefit of their children but they will bear the burden of having them.
Then you can tell your children, your grandchildren you voted for this. You voted for the right to have another person infringe upon their liberty. Depriving them of their blood property and their income property because you wanted and in fact did that to their dad.
I believe under your roof, your benefit, your burden. If you want to leave your union. You are free to do so. But you are not free to deprive your ex of their liberty or their property. Unless of course, you and the government are willing to compensate them??? Then we put this matter back to a trial by jury system. We the People vote on what is fair compensation and if it’s fair at all to take another person’s property without compensating them.
As of right now. It’s my opinion that most are missing the boat. They think it’s good, even funny, to have a person’s blood property taken and their income property too. So long as they are not footing the bill. As such, they don’t care who left the union. As long as they are not the one paying.
You talk about not earning enough to live lawfully. That’s not your ex’s fault. It’s a failure of our system. Where people are smart enough to earn their employer a profit but are considered to stupid to earn a living wage. If we agree the minimum wage is an amount which is enough for a person to care for their family. We then must also agree any amount i.e. discretionary income above that is profit. That being the case. The U.S. Tax Payer is subsidizing the profits of business owners who pay less then a living wage. Because the U.S. Tax Payer has to make up the difference thought food-stamps etc.
Like Walmart… Low Prices BUT Higher Taxes because we the people have to make up the difference in wages else their workers will not be able to live lawfully.
“I’m curious, what did those judges do for the mother owed child support and the children dependent on it? And, are you seriously proud that the number of “deadbeat” dads is so high? There are 25 million of you? And how many children are out there with no one to depend on but a mother because of you 25 million?” I will assume your misinterpretation of my post was due to simply misreading it and not a malicious slight. The 25 million refers to the number of noncustodial parents and not the number of “deadbeat” dads. At any rate, I will tell you what the judges and the legal system have done for the mothers who are raising children “all on their own”. THey have given them sole control over the child. Fatherood has dissapeared for divorced dads, 50/50 parenting is not considered and at best you are a visitor, at worst you are just erased from the child’s life. They have given them child support and a ranage of massive governemnt benefits. In some cases child support is transfered from the impoverished father to the wealthy mother. Does this mean we need accross the board reform? No, we need to tweak the system. But yes, having more opportunities for 50/50 parenting is a big part of that.
Cathy will never be able to understand she’s the one getting child support not paying, if she paid it might be a different story but right now she has no clue as to what she’s talking about. it’s about the same equivalent other person whos never had kids telling someone else how to raise kids.
Cathy will never be able to understand she’s the one getting child support not paying, if she paid it might be a different story but right now she has no clue as to what she’s talking about. it’s about the same equivalent other person whos never had kids telling someone else how to raise kids.
Personally, I find it extremely offensive to hear any parent complain about taking care of their kids, regardless of who is ordered to pay child support. Many parents don’t receive those awards. AND NO we all aren’t stay at home moms/dads sitting on our butts waiting on checks from our exes. Many of us work full time jobs and even two jobs just to make ends meet. When you have a child, why do parents even remotely think it is okay to not hold down steady jobs to help provide for their kids??? There is an enormous amount of resentment when all the responsibility is placed on one parent because the other parent is irresponsible. And as far as state child enforcement agencies, that is a joke. Sincerely, single working parent of two owed THOUSANDS in child support.
Cathy, this is a great article. Very balanced. As a father who pays child support, you hit the nail on the head. I would give everything to my children, but like you said, it does bother me writing a check to my ex and not knowing where that money is going…and in some cases knowing it is not going to my children. But, those are issues that I need to deal with. But, reform of some sort would seem to be warrented. In my specific example, I have paid on time more than has been required of me for three years per our MSA. I agreed to this for a number of reasons, however, now that it is time to recalculate, per our MSA, suddenly my ex’s salary has dropped to 17k a year (from 46k the previous year) . Sure, I can go to court and pay all sorts of money to lawyers (money I would rather see go to my kids) and in the end, maybe I win. But, what do I win? A worse relationship with my ex? How does that benefit my children? So, what do I do? Continue to pay my ex inflated support payments, in essence, pay her to maintain a good relationship with me for the benefit of our children while I can barely pay my bills…which by the way, also impacts the kids because I have them 45% of the time and need to provide for them. I could go on, but bottom line, reform is needed with the holistic view of the children taken into account.
My Ex husband didn’t wanted me to support him and the children while we were married. He lied about his income in divorce proceeding thinking he wouldn’t have to pay any child support. He was ordered to pay $100 a month for 2 kids. He has a net worth of over $1M and an income of over $100K a year, yet he was taking the kids to eat at soup kitchens so that he could write about how paying child support was leaving him destitute. He was telling women that he was so financially devestated from the divorce and paying child support to set the bar so low that they would feel sorry for him and pay for dates. He tried to tell me the same story. I asked and was granted after a 7 month trial that all the previous child support award be set aside and recalculated. He had to pay $25K in my attorney’s fees and arrears. Why should child support be reduced by percentage of time a child spends with their father. There is no requirement their father actually spend any mone on them. We should put the father’s who yell the loudest about paying child support under a microscope and look at their true motives. A mother shouldn’t have to spend herself into penniless so that she could provide for her children while their children’s father buys himself more rental properties to increase his income and then uses the money to pay down the mortages to add to his net worth. It is a scam that child support is reduced by percentage of time. The deadbeats Dad’s just insist on the most amount of time with their kids. It is not a coincidence that the same amendment is used to justify not pay child support is the same amendment used to justify not paying income taxes. It is a completely selfish and antisocial argument.
I am a father who pays child support. I have paid child support for over 12 years now. I have paid exactly $71,256 dollars plus over $1,000 in fees that the system charges me to deduct it out of my check. My problem with child support is where does the money go that I pay? I feel I am 100% financially responsible for my child and her mother does not contribute any finances. It is supposed to be 50-50. We made this child together. Next why do I have to give the system $1,000 to take money out of my check? That is money that could have gone to my daughter. I have never missed a child support payment so why do I need someone taking it from me? I am an adult. Next, I believe that an account should be set up so the child can receive 20% of the total paid to child support when the child turns 18. By my estimates when my child turns 18 I will have paid close to $86,000 in child support and close to $1,500 in fees over 15 1/2 years. Will my daughter have a college fund? Will my daughter get a car? I say probably not because there is no accountability on her mother’s part of where this money goes. My child’s mother is not on the system. She has a master’s degree and is a respiratory therapist at a hospital. I just don’t agree with the system.
This article is quite possibly one of the most infuriating articles I’ve read in recent memory. Not only does it insist that all non-custodial parents are deadbeat dads who don’t want to take care of their children, but it shows custodial parents as self righteous moms who are somehow entitled to the fathers’ income, regardless of whether the dad can afford to feed themselves or not. To me, these assumptions are what causes a huge majority of the debate in the first place.
Cathy, you say that physical custody and child support are two totally separate issues and normally I would agree with you. However, I’d like to tell you a story and see what you think.
A man and a woman have two daughters. The couple has an awful relationship, lots of fighting, accusations of infidelity and general unhappiness. The fighting is never physical, but no one that knows them would insist they have a healthy relationship. The dad adores his daughters and spends every possible moment with them.
The mom decides one day that she’s had enough and leaves. She packs up everything in the house while the dad is at work and moves away with the daughters without telling him where they are going. The dad desparately tries to keep in contact with her so he can spend time with the girls and provide necessities such as diapers, clothing and food. Eventually, without confirming their location or well-being, the mom changes her phone number and disappears. The dad tries to go to the police for help, citing parental kidnapping, but they insist it’s a matter for the courts. The dad attempts to file for custody, but his case is dismissed because he can’t have her properly served without knowing her location.
After about a year and a half, the dad goes to the school district office for a copy of his oldest daughter’s school records. After arguing with the clerk briefly about state law giving him rights to the records, he obtains a copy. The clerk mistakenly did not block out the current address and the dad learns the location of the mom and daughters. He then files for custody and is ordered to pay child support while attending reunification therapy prior to implementing equal parenting time with his daughters, who now refuse to see him due to their mom’s influence while he was away. Court ordered therapy is extremely expensive, and, because the mom is not supportive of the dad having a relationship with his daughters, extremely lengthy. The dad was laid off shortly after being ordered to pay child support and was denied a modification to the amount when he was unable to locate comparable employment.
The dad had to choose between paying child support and paying for a therapist to build a relationship with his daughters so that he could have equal parenting time, which in turn would reduce the amount of child support he was ordered to pay. Not to mention paying rent, food and gas to get to and from any job that would enable him to pay child support and therapy. If he doesn’t pay for the therapy, he has no relationship with his daughters and no chance to implement equal parenting time. However, if he doesn’t pay child support, he loses his driver’s license and potentially his job or goes to jail. If he pays both, he can’t pay for rent or food or gas to go to work. How does a parent, any parent, make a decision like that? And why should they have to choose between a relationship with their children or child support or basic living expenses? Does that make him a deadbeat when he just can’t keep up with all of it? When he lives on the charity of others so he can continue to see his children?
Before you judge all dads as “deadbeats”, consider the fact that there are a million other scenarios. Child support reform might be the answer, but it’s a very sensitive issue and we must not insist that one side is completely right and one is completely wrong.
So this article discussed the need (which we all agree needs to happen) for reform, but I am not seeing where it’s a living/working document in progress. Is it just the idea of the author, or is there some legs to this somewhere in Washington? I’m a big fan of reform and would like to become part of the solution. Tell us where to get more information. (I did see the familylaw conference, posted by mychoice, that is a different animal).
Let’s take a quick look at my state, Vermont, definition of “Fair”. Take for example our hypothetical couple, Bob and Sue. Bob is a hard working college educated professional who make 92K a year. Sue, liked to spend her free time washing down depressants with alcohol and eventually, due to court order, found a job making minimum wage for 20 hours a week. The couple shared physical custody 50/50. The State calculator yielded a “Fair child support figure of $450.00 that Bob was to pay.
If the percentage of time the children changed 70% with Sue and 30% with Bob the calculator results change to Bob owing $1100.00/month. Could someone please explain how a 20% increase in time results in Bob’s child support increasing 240% is fair?
Please Ms. Meyer, certainly with your advanced degree somewhere along the line you must have had a basic math course.
Now, for those of you with more advanced analytical skills, let’s dive into this a little deeper. Both Bob and Sue have to maintain housing for themselves and their children, and according to laws this should be similar to what the children would enjoy prior to the dissolution of the marriage. (various states have various wording) From this we can assume that both Bob and Sue have the same base housing costs; Rent/mortgage, utilities, insurance. These are FIXED COSTS, they remain the same regardless of how many people are spending the night or number of nights they spend. (Ok granted Electric and heating cost will go up a small percentage, were not talking hundreds of dollars here) The only major variable costs that would increase with Sue having more time with the children would be food.
Again someone please explain how Sue receiving and extra $650 a month to provide and extra 6 meals is fair? I know teenagers eat a lot but seriously?
Now let’s look at another tidbit of information that should factor into the equation, but doesn’t. Sue lives rent free, Bob’s mortgage, taxes and insurance is approx. $1200/mo. Nowhere in the Child support calculators is housing costs factored into the equation.
I can’t help but wonder if the earning and work ethics roles of the afore mentioned couple was reversed if the author would still consider the methods for calculating child support to be fair?
I find it hard to believe that the author can with straight face say “…with all sincerity that the child support guidelines are fair.” But then again this isn’t the first daddy bigot article she has penned, or been taken to task for.
Is it any wonder why there is such a big incentive for divorcing couples to argue about how much time they get awarded to the kids?
Watch and learn who really gets hurt by the child support system.
http://vimeo.com/ondemand/16056/78685280
Cathy, your bias is evident even in the patronizing picture of the frowning man that accompanies this article. You label any man who chafes at the inequities of the child support system as a selfish whiner who is just angry at their ex (which is ironic, since your anger at your ex could not be any more obvious), yet you make no attempt to even begin to understand the many legitimate inequities built into the system from the father’s perspective, nor do you bother to treat non-custodial fathers with even a modicum of respect. And you honestly wonder why you get such angry e-mails? Your one-sided perspective on this complex issue is truly offensive and disturbing.
Whether or not fathers should support their children is not the issue. Obviously, both parents should do so. The question is how that support should be determined, and how best to encourage payment without destroying another person’s life. Your blithe dismissal of the very real financial and familial challenges confronted by non-custodial parents is insulting. You have never paid child support, or had to deal with the threat of debtor’s prison, garnished wages, or an ex who spends the “child support” on herself and ignores the children’s basic needs (and yes, it happens all the time). You have no right to sit in judgment of the men who deal with circumstances and people you have never encountered and cannot possibly comprehend.
Before you sit in self-righteous judgment of all non-custodial fathers, try walking a mile in their shoes.
Greg, I admit to having a bias against anyone, man or woman who whines about having to pay child support. I own that! I do request you point out specifically where in the article my anger at my ex is “obvious.” My ex isn’t mentioned in the article! My ex never complained about paying child support. If there was one thing he was clear on it was his obligation to support his children. He may have been late on a few occasions but he never missed a child support payment when I our children were still young enough. So, wrong, my anger at my ex has nothing to do with this article. Non-custodial fathers who complain about paying child support, don’t understand their moral obligation to their children and who quote skewed facts about the impact of paying child support have not earned my respect. It isn’t my respect they should be concerned with though. It is their children’s respect they will one day wish they had earned and the fact that they didn’t will be on them, not me or the fact they were order to pay child support.
I can attest that my ex-wife thinks the child support system is unfair. She thinks that she should be able to decide how her money is best used (purchasing clothes for example). She also thinks that because I make 5x what she does, she shouldn’t have to pay, but to be fair, she also thinks that the legal definition of child support is money that men pay women, so take that one with a grain of salt.
I do know people with dead beat (according to them) ex’s. Most of them underpaying or behind in some fashion. But I also believe that when you toss out parents that are incarcerated or are behind because of their time in jail, I think that number comes way way down.
The one reform I’d like to see is an evaluation of the criteria against an intact family or the custodial parent. For example, if the married or custodial parent looses their job or has to take a significant pay cut, the family simply must adjust to the fact. It’s immediate. There’s no requirement to somehow makeup the loss. The same should be true for the non-custodial parent. Building huge arrearages due to disablity or un/under employment seems unfair when the same exact event does not cause an issue with the custodial parent. My ex-wife (I have custody) got in a car accident and was out of work for several months. She lives paycheck to paycheck. She petitioned the court for relief and they turned her down (it wasn’t me, I didn’t fight it). So now technically, she’s a deadbeat who’s three month behind, with no prospect of getting caught up soon as she is also strugling with the medical bills.
Im a man who had to support a child when the mother knew. I wasnt the father, i feel they should reform the 2 year statue of limitations for paternity, women blame men for children and years later he finds out she lied, i feel as though they should be made to pay every cent back and tell the courts who the father is, there has been cases of the falsely accused man having to pay, and the real father resides in the home with the child, the courts should be more fair about these sort of issues, a man shouldn’t have to pay even if its 10 years from the day he started, how do you put limitations on life, if a person committed a crime and was convicted dna evidence would free him, even if it was 30 years ago, so why don’t the law do the same for falsely accused fathers, and we say its in the best interest of the child, wrong again the best interest of the child is the truth, and it also sets boundaries for the child to not marry a brother or sister, due to a mother’s dirty little secret, yes this kind of mess needs reform
Im a stepmom. They just modify the child support for my stepdaughter after the mother of my stepdaughter applied for food stamps. Now my husband shall pay $850 a month for one child with a net income of $1600. Huh? Whats going on there? Thats more the 50 % of his net income just because his ex collect kids of different men and he is the only one who pays child support and they give parts of his child support to the other children of the mother (he has nothing to do with them, they have all other fathers) and what him to pay the food stamps of his daughter plus the normal child support. The system sucks, now we either will be homeless or without food or he is not able to come to work anymore. Or said in another way: We have §750 per month for 3 person (2 Adult, 1 Newborn) and he has to pay $850 to his first daughter, while the mother of his daughter keep sitting on the couch watch TV be online and drop off a child every year of a different guy, get her nails and her hair done, has 3 cars and my stepdaughter still does not have any clothers in her size without holes or scholl supplies. There is nothing right about the system. Whats with our child? While he has to pay for his daughter and all the kids of the other kids (all younger then my stepdaughter and my husband was never married to her mother or even in a relationship) we are broke and our child has to stay in broke too sometimes without water and lights just because the system sucks and nobody cares if she freezes or starve but my husband pays for strangers.
N, your ex is paying a large amount because he was in arrears on his child support. When his ex had to go to the state with help feeding her children the state came after him for payment of what they have already spent. The solution to your problem is for your husband to pay his support on time. And, it doesn’t matter how many children his ex has by how many men. The state will only come after him for money he owes for HIS child. The system doesn’t suck. Non-custodial parents who don’t pay suck. What do you do with your day? Do you work? Do you sit at home on the computer or watching television? It sounds like there needs to be more than one income coming into the home you’ve built in order for the family to have what they need. Have you considered getting a job? And, what will you do if you two divorce, will you not expect him to pay child support for the child you have with him? Especially since you have no income or livelihood of your own.
N, your ex is paying a large amount because he was in arrears on his child support. When his ex had to go to the state with help feeding her children the state came after him for payment of what they have already spent. The solution to your problem is for your husband to pay his support on time. And, it doesn’t matter how many children his ex has by how many men. The state will only come after him for money he owes for HIS child. The system doesn’t suck. Non-custodial parents who don’t pay suck. What do you do with your day? Do you work? Do you sit at home on the computer or watching television? It sounds like there needs to be more than one income coming into the home you’ve built in order for the family to have what they need. Have you considered getting a job? And, what will you do if you two divorce, will you not expect him to pay child support for the child you have with him? Especially since you have no income or livelihood of your own.
Your point of view is so flawed and one-sided that you can’t see anything but money. Reading about how your children’s father did your children, I can understand. I would never do that to my kids. At the same time, I believe that all my kids are equal, and I should not give more than I would be willing to give the other. Your argument is that this woman should work. My question is who then raises the kids? Please don’t say dual parent households are common, because you will validate every reason why child care reform is required.
Isn’t it paying less money you are arguing for? How can you accuse me of having flawed thinking when your argument is based on money? Here is the thing about my children’s father. He abandoned them, has NOTHING to do with them for some reason BUT even though he chose to not be part of their lives he never once missed a child support payment. I got a check monthly from him. They never heard from him, he couldn’t manage to stand by his moral obligation to parent them but he did manage to stand by his moral obligation to support them. For that, they will always be grateful. My ex couldn’t emotionally afford to be part of his children’s lives but he did, at least, understand and put all effort into financially supporting them. We all, as parents, have that obligation. The ability to support a child trumps the desire to have a child. The woman above chose to have a child with a man who has a low income AND already had children to support. How is that the responsibility of the family court or his previous children? When it comes to children and parenting them it does come down to money. If you are going to have more than you can afford your children are going to suffer. The family court system holds parents RESPONSIBLE financially. Something that some parents don’t seem to be able to do themselves. My ex, even with all the emotional wounds he deals with understood that.
I am not arguing for paying less money, I am discussing that there should be more factors at play than just a man’s income. This woman may work, but I can say from experience that the amount of money that comes out from child support limits the amount of disposable income in that home. While she may be working, they have to live on an extremely tight budget. Any unexpected issue could set that whole family back. You talk as if everyone can make 100k or that this economy is booming. 1600 after taxes puts him around 25k gross a year roughly. There are plenty of children living at or below the poverty level in this country that don’t even have the benefit of having parents who work at all, that probably do better than some of these men that have to pay child support. I don’t think the system was designed to stop anyone from being unable to find love, get married, and raise a family. Your response is typical of someone who really has never had to struggle really struggle in this country. I am pretty sure you did not need any government assistance during the time you were raising your children. The system as it stands right now punishes those who care for their children, strive for success, and work while giving passes to those that sit around all day a slap on the wrist. Now if a man is just out having kids on top of kids, then he should go broke for all I care. However, if a man gets married and starts a family, those kids are entitled to the same care he has been giving his previous children. If that cannot be provided then, an adjustment needs to be part of the toolkit. It shouldn’t be off the table completly.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
N, your husband isn’t paying support for all of her children. He is paying support for his child. He is paying the large amount of support because he was in arrears, the state had to spend money to help support his child and now he has to pay the child support plus the state. You have talked yourself into believing he is paying $50 per child, which makes no sense at all because $50 per child is only $300 dollars a month. Here is your real issue. You live in a 40 year old mobile home with a man who can’t afford better because he is being forced to support a child he had before he met you. Now you expect that child to do without so you can have a better lifestyle. It doesn’t work that way. I would like to ask though, you speak of $850 a month like it is a lot of money. Like his ex is living high off the hog on $850 a month with herself and 6 children. Yet you, your husband and children…only 3 people can’t manage on virtually the same amount? Makes no sense!
I don�t think you read Cahy. 350/7=50 thats how they did 6 children plus mother are 7. And I didnt talk myself into it. That is what the calculation said. I have here a paper what it says. I know what Im talking about. Sorry but you cantbe very smart. if you only read the half. I dont see any reason how is our problem if she had only $850 for herself and her 6 children. And by the way she has way more then that. You sont even need to think only because she get welfare she only has welfare. She is making extra money anyhow and Im sure I dont want to know how. Because my husband has only to support ONE of the children no one else. Plus nobody says she shall do without, but the $350 before was enough. Dont forget Cathy she is 10 years old and has a mother too. As soon as the kids are in school the mother should pay the half of the support too and there is then no excuse because she gets more kids. She is half of the mother, I dont see any reason why the father should be the only one who pays for it. If the mother gets on welfare and the father already paying support why should he pay more? Its not his fault that she isnt working. And I will tell it you now again, a child has 2 parents and both should pay the half of the support, there is no way around and you can say what you want if the women goes on welfare when the child is in school age and the father pays then she should pay the money back to the state and no one else. Your post make no sense thats what it is.
This view is way off base. The state child support system does not take into consideration the other child living in his home as N stated. Did she state he was behind on child support? NO she did not. She stated because the mother applied for food stamps the child support went up to $850 a month. You keep defending the mothers of these children without all the facts or overlooking what you have been told. I find you and I on different ends of the spectrum where you would prefer to see the fathers suffer I would prefer to see equality in how a child is raised and showing child that is by also holding the mother accountable and making her work. Please don’t sit here and tell me that a mothers job is to raise her children. I am a mother of 5 beautiful children and not only do I work at home with them I work outside the home NOT our of necessity but because I feel it is my obligation to my children to show them that a mother and a father BOTH support them in everything they do.
This view is way off base. The state child support system does not take into consideration the other child living in his home as N stated. Did she state he was behind on child support? NO she did not. She stated because the mother applied for food stamps the child support went up to $850 a month. You keep defending the mothers of these children without all the facts or overlooking what you have been told. I find you and I on different ends of the spectrum where you would prefer to see the fathers suffer I would prefer to see equality in how a child is raised and showing child that is by also holding the mother accountable and making her work. Please don’t sit here and tell me that a mothers job is to raise her children. I am a mother of 5 beautiful children and not only do I work at home with them I work outside the home NOT our of necessity but because I feel it is my obligation to my children to show them that a mother and a father BOTH support them in everything they do.
This view is way off base. The state child support system does not take into consideration the other child living in his home as N stated. Did she state he was behind on child support? NO she did not. She stated because the mother applied for food stamps the child support went up to $850 a month. You keep defending the mothers of these children without all the facts or overlooking what you have been told. I find you and I on different ends of the spectrum where you would prefer to see the fathers suffer I would prefer to see equality in how a child is raised and showing child that is by also holding the mother accountable and making her work. Please don’t sit here and tell me that a mothers job is to raise her children. I am a mother of 5 beautiful children and not only do I work at home with them I work outside the home NOT our of necessity but because I feel it is my obligation to my children to show them that a mother and a father BOTH support them in everything they do.
This view is way off base. The state child support system does not take into consideration the other child living in his home as N stated. Did she state he was behind on child support? NO she did not. She stated because the mother applied for food stamps the child support went up to $850 a month. You keep defending the mothers of these children without all the facts or overlooking what you have been told. I find you and I on different ends of the spectrum where you would prefer to see the fathers suffer I would prefer to see equality in how a child is raised and showing child that is by also holding the mother accountable and making her work. Please don’t sit here and tell me that a mothers job is to raise her children. I am a mother of 5 beautiful children and not only do I work at home with them I work outside the home NOT our of necessity but because I feel it is my obligation to my children to show them that a mother and a father BOTH support them in everything they do.
This article is very misleading and Cathy, you’ve ignored all the reasonable replies to fit your agenda. I’m hoping you don’t ignore me. Child support does need reform, and payment reduction should definitely be included in the reform. 1st child support and child custody should be considered the same issue, because last I checked and based on your posts mother’s have the burden of raising children all by themselves. So why not include that in the process, because that’s what children really need more than a paycheck to mom. Those father’s need the opportunity to be there and make decisions about they’re child’s future. Second, it is not fair that my children in my current relationship with my wife, suffer because 25% of my income goes to my children’s mother from my previous relationship. The kids that are with me and my wife aren’t guaranteed to see 25% of my income on payday due to bills and other obligations, but my kids MOTHER is guaranteed that amount each month regardless of my circumstances. Based on your article that is okay with you. My kids mother stays with her mother, works, and still claims I owe her more money. If my children live in these circumstances when I’m paying support, shouldn’t I be entitled to try to do better, or am I just supposed to buy her lodging as well Cathy? Your whole article lumps the non custodial parent into the category of unwilling to pay or trying to cheat the system. There are plenty of custodial parents that are cheating the system as well. So what is the reform for those parents?
I have not ignored any “reasonable” replies to this article. The more unreasonable, the more likely I am to not respond. And there are a few unreasonable comments here. Mothers have the burden of raising children on their own because the vast majority of divorced fathers have no desire to parent their children. Only 22% of divorced fathers see their children more than once a week. More than 80% voluntarily give custody to the mother at the time of the divorce with no attempt to gain shared custody. Based on that it only makes sense that custody and support remain two separate legal issues. Children NEED a father and a paycheck. They don’t clothe and feed themselves! Since most fathers bow out on parental responsibilities after divorce the courts can at least order a paycheck since they aren’t able to litigate moral responsibility. And now, I’m done with you. Your statement about a “paycheck to mom” tells me all I need to know about you. You want your cake and eat it too. You want to spread your seed, create children and not be held responsible. When you are held responsible it is some woman’s fault, you are the innocent victim. You feign concern about your second set of children having to do without because you have to pay for the first set when, in reality, your anger probably has nothing to do with whether your children have what they need or not but with you being angry about having to send a monthly check to a woman. You want to do better, get out and do better. Your ex living with her mother isn’t holding you back in any form or fashion. The only thing that has a grip on you is your anger over having to support your children.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
My anger does not come from having to pay child support. I am one of the 22% you dismiss. I offered to keep my kids, she turned me down for child support money. My children’s mother lives with her mom. My kids didn’t get their own room until there aunt moved with her kids a few months ago. I went and placed myself on child support because I found out my children’s mother was trying to say I wasn’t paying her at all when we had a verbal agreement which I was keeping my end of the bargain. The child support ended up being less than what I was giving here. Between placing myself on child support, I got married, had a family, and I am still obligated to pay the same amount of support even though I have more kids. You conveniently picked what you wanted from my response. I wholeheartedly agree that children need a father and a paycheck, however, you miss the point. If the father has another family that needs him just as much, the sacrifice must be shared evenly. You did not address the issue in your response. You have done like you always do, dismiss me as being a no good father, and tell me that’s why the courts exist. I await your response.
I don’t dismiss the 22%, I dismiss the other 78%. And, your ex could make the argument that you offered to “keep” the kids in order to not pay child support. Good for you for “placing” yourself on child support. I’m betting you chose to start paying the lower amount.
I don’t dismiss the 22%, I dismiss the other 78%. And, your ex could make the argument that you offered to “keep” the kids in order to not pay child support. Good for you for “placing” yourself on child support. I’m betting you chose to start paying the lower amount.
I’m not missing any point, you are. It upsets you that your child support can’t be reduced now that you have a set of children with another woman. That isn’t reasonable or logical thinking though. If you owned a house and went out and purchased another house you couldn’t afford would you feel it unfair if the bank refused to lower the payments on your first house? Isn’t it only logical not to choose to take on more than you can afford? Why should your first set of children suffer the consequences of you choosing to have more children if you couldn’t afford those children? I have two children, I wanted to adopt a third child. I put a lot of thought into it and didn’t because I couldn’t afford a third child. I know you will find the idea of not being able to have more children because you already had children you were support an appalling concept but, that is life. It is common sense.
You are making wild assumptions and not looking at the facts again Cathy. If you read my whole reply, you would see that I placed myself on child support because she was trying to report me as not paying in order to receive back pay. The system considers anything not put into it a gift here in MS. So even though I was paying her, had I not kept an accurate account of what I paid her and why I would have ended up owing her not only the reduced child support that she sought, but bogus arrears fees as well. You missed that part of my reply, but no biggie. I will continue to school you. Why should it matter who keeps the children, if there needs will be met? I’m sorry, but last time I checked I put 23 chromosomes into those kids too. I have my own house and can provide my children with a better standard of living, education, and health care than they currently have now. I offered to keep the kids so she could complete nursing school which would allow her to provide a better standard of living for our children than what they currently have. She did not want to give me the children in order to keep that check rolling. Of course, she couldn’t pass nursing school with the added burden of having to raise our kids and the demands of the school, but hey! She kept that check right? Once I got married, my wife’s kids became part of my responsibility as well. No, I just don’t go around making babies for the sake of making them. My wife’s children’s father does pay support, but his support for 2 children is considerably less than what I pay for support for my 2 children, even though we have similar incomes. Do you want to know why that is Cathy? It is because he had children prior to the two he had with her, so those children are weighted differently even though he is equally responsible for all of them. I have been in my kids lives from day 1. You so elegantly complained in your article the burden of being the primary custodian of the children. How did you put it when referring to your ex that left. Here’s the quote straight from your article:
“I’m a single mother who provided for the majority of her children’s financial needs until they graduated from college. My ex-husband walked away from our marriage with 87% of his income and livid about paying the remaining 13% in child support. His complaint was, “how am I supposed to live?” My response, the one that finally left him stopped his complaints, “You’ll live a hell of a lot better lifestyle than your children.”
Not only was my ex receiving my child support, she was also receiving government assistance (again, abusing the system). You are a mother so I expect you to know better than most, what you do for one child, you would do for all of your children. So yes, Cathy, something is wrong with this picture. You may want to take off those rose-colored glasses you are wearing because the this isn’t the 1960’s anymore.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I don�t have a car anymore, we don�t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with /- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I�m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe �1 more a month.
Sorry Cathy but you see it in a wrong way. It is complete normal in families that children has to share the income of the parents. Just because the children has 2 different mothers cant mean that the first is getting everything but the second gets nothing. You say its right that the mother can gets as much children she wants and somebody has to pay for all these kids he has nothing to do with because the kids has to share, but the second child deserves nothing because th first child gets all. then they shall give my stepdaughter all the support my husband pays for her and dont share it with her “half” siblings. Then we had enough for us too. And I will tell it you now again, its not right, that your are giving the mother every right for her, but say in the same way only the mother can get a whole bunch of kids but the fathers deserves only one and he has to support only this one. The father has every right to get more kids and then its normal that the kids has to share the support, thats an easy thing and thats the only thing whats right. How you want explain any kids that its right that her siser can get shoes for $100 because she is older and more worth but the second child can only get shoes for $5 because Cathy and the court says its nothing worth because its younger. And thats just because the the mother of the stepdaughter is to stupid to keeps her legs close and has every moth another men and can live like a princess with it. Thats kinda protitution and its absolutly not right that a court let a child stays at such women where they see its right to fuck around and you can get a whole bunch of money if you just have enough kids from different men, the trick is just have a different father for every child. Just think about that if every father of the 6 childs has to pay $850 a month the mother gets $5100 a month tax free and without leaving her house, then she only needs to have luck like the ex of my husband and stay for free anywhere just pay water, light, internet, tc, phone car insurance and gas and suprise she has $4000 a moth left over. So thats then $571 for every person in the household left over for food, clothers etc. or $666 for every child or $19/$22 per day without she ever left the house, while all the fathers are broke. While the mother then don�t save every money for college the broke father has to pay the college too after all. While the second child has $2 per day if the mother isnt leaving the house. The second child even doesnt has any chance the it can go to college, while the first one gets all. Thats discrimination and agains the law. How shall that be right in your eyes? Plus there is a big different of the age, when you have kids in school age, you can work without problems, if you have infants and you want to work you have to pay expansiv daycare and you see where it ends again? you make the first father paying for the other childs of his ex again, because if she had only his child the were able to work without problems, but she has infants who counts on child support, but in the other ways the younger kids of the man dont count on child support. Thats a big problem. The mother stays always better than the father. ALL her kids counts for both, only his FIRST child counts on his side. and by the way Cathy if you have to pay $850 child support for one child and has $750 for yourself, he even cant make it as a single with $750 a month. There still max $150 left for food and gas, so after gas he has then maybe $50 for food. At the end he runs around nakes because there is no way to buy clothers if the old ones are messed up and is underweighted because there is not way to feed yourself with $12.50 a week thats not even $2 a day. He still can eat only dry nuddles, Potatoes and rice like we has to do it and drink water out of the line. There is nothing with a heat or air at home or internet and a TV or even a phone.
Sorry Cathy but you see it in a wrong way. It is complete normal in families that children has to share the income of the parents. Just because the children has 2 different mothers cant mean that the first is getting everything but the second gets nothing. You say its right that the mother can gets as much children she wants and somebody has to pay for all these kids he has nothing to do with because the kids has to share, but the second child deserves nothing because th first child gets all. then they shall give my stepdaughter all the support my husband pays for her and dont share it with her “half” siblings. Then we had enough for us too. And I will tell it you now again, its not right, that your are giving the mother every right for her, but say in the same way only the mother can get a whole bunch of kids but the fathers deserves only one and he has to support only this one. The father has every right to get more kids and then its normal that the kids has to share the support, thats an easy thing and thats the only thing whats right. How you want explain any kids that its right that her siser can get shoes for $100 because she is older and more worth but the second child can only get shoes for $5 because Cathy and the court says its nothing worth because its younger. And thats just because the the mother of the stepdaughter is to stupid to keeps her legs close and has every moth another men and can live like a princess with it. Thats kinda protitution and its absolutly not right that a court let a child stays at such women where they see its right to fuck around and you can get a whole bunch of money if you just have enough kids from different men, the trick is just have a different father for every child. Just think about that if every father of the 6 childs has to pay $850 a month the mother gets $5100 a month tax free and without leaving her house, then she only needs to have luck like the ex of my husband and stay for free anywhere just pay water, light, internet, tc, phone car insurance and gas and suprise she has $4000 a moth left over. So thats then $571 for every person in the household left over for food, clothers etc. or $666 for every child or $19/$22 per day without she ever left the house, while all the fathers are broke. While the mother then don�t save every money for college the broke father has to pay the college too after all. While the second child has $2 per day if the mother isnt leaving the house. The second child even doesnt has any chance the it can go to college, while the first one gets all. Thats discrimination and agains the law. How shall that be right in your eyes? Plus there is a big different of the age, when you have kids in school age, you can work without problems, if you have infants and you want to work you have to pay expansiv daycare and you see where it ends again? you make the first father paying for the other childs of his ex again, because if she had only his child the were able to work without problems, but she has infants who counts on child support, but in the other ways the younger kids of the man dont count on child support. Thats a big problem. The mother stays always better than the father. ALL her kids counts for both, only his FIRST child counts on his side. and by the way Cathy if you have to pay $850 child support for one child and has $750 for yourself, he even cant make it as a single with $750 a month. There still max $150 left for food and gas, so after gas he has then maybe $50 for food. At the end he runs around nakes because there is no way to buy clothers if the old ones are messed up and is underweighted because there is not way to feed yourself with $12.50 a week thats not even $2 a day. He still can eat only dry nuddles, Potatoes and rice like we has to do it and drink water out of the line. There is nothing with a heat or air at home or internet and a TV or even a phone.
N,
I understand what you are trying to say, but please do not let your emotions get the better of you. It is hard to decipher some of your points. This is an emotional topic, but that is exactly what judges want to justify denying you any type of adjustment if you and your husband ever try to receive a decrease. Stay professional, and remember that everything is for the well being of all the children as a whole.
You’re being dishonest Cathy and I suspect you know it. The family court system has created a status quo of mother custody. Most men simply do not have the means to wage a legal war for shared custody when they know they won’t get it anyway. Which is why feminist groups freak out over shared parenting legislation. The vast majority of fathers face continual custodial interference from ex-wives that can be certain they will face no consequences for their actions.
Children of second marriages are routinely expected to do without in favor of children with child support orders. The why is pretty simple, the state child support agency isn’t getting any money for those children so they’re not concerned with their living conditions. It’s not an equitable arrangement and someone without an obvious financial incentive to want the status quo, as you have, would see that.
You’re being dishonest Cathy and I suspect you know it. The family court system has created a status quo of mother custody. Most men simply do not have the means to wage a legal war for shared custody when they know they won’t get it anyway. Which is why feminist groups freak out over shared parenting legislation. The vast majority of fathers face continual custodial interference from ex-wives that can be certain they will face no consequences for their actions.
Children of second marriages are routinely expected to do without in favor of children with child support orders. The why is pretty simple, the state child support agency isn’t getting any money for those children so they’re not concerned with their living conditions. It’s not an equitable arrangement and someone without an obvious financial incentive to want the status quo, as you have, would see that.
You’re being dishonest Cathy and I suspect you know it. The family court system has created a status quo of mother custody. Most men simply do not have the means to wage a legal war for shared custody when they know they won’t get it anyway. Which is why feminist groups freak out over shared parenting legislation. The vast majority of fathers face continual custodial interference from ex-wives that can be certain they will face no consequences for their actions.
Children of second marriages are routinely expected to do without in favor of children with child support orders. The why is pretty simple, the state child support agency isn’t getting any money for those children so they’re not concerned with their living conditions. It’s not an equitable arrangement and someone without an obvious financial incentive to want the status quo, as you have, would see that.
You’re being dishonest Cathy and I suspect you know it. The family court system has created a status quo of mother custody. Most men simply do not have the means to wage a legal war for shared custody when they know they won’t get it anyway. Which is why feminist groups freak out over shared parenting legislation. The vast majority of fathers face continual custodial interference from ex-wives that can be certain they will face no consequences for their actions.
Children of second marriages are routinely expected to do without in favor of children with child support orders. The why is pretty simple, the state child support agency isn’t getting any money for those children so they’re not concerned with their living conditions. It’s not an equitable arrangement and someone without an obvious financial incentive to want the status quo, as you have, would see that.
You’re being dishonest Cathy and I suspect you know it. The family court system has created a status quo of mother custody. Most men simply do not have the means to wage a legal war for shared custody when they know they won’t get it anyway. Which is why feminist groups freak out over shared parenting legislation. The vast majority of fathers face continual custodial interference from ex-wives that can be certain they will face no consequences for their actions.
Children of second marriages are routinely expected to do without in favor of children with child support orders. The why is pretty simple, the state child support agency isn’t getting any money for those children so they’re not concerned with their living conditions. It’s not an equitable arrangement and someone without an obvious financial incentive to want the status quo, as you have, would see that.
Ok Cathy I shall work? I worked my whole live, but you better explain me right now how I should come to work, I donßt have a car anymore, we don´t have money for a downpayment, to fix the old one or buy an old one. Then the child needs a daycare, I needs gas money, car insurance etc. Even if I get the money anyhow to get a car. In my calculation it was end up with +/- o more money after I paid car insurance, gas, daycare, taxes and ss. I had to make at least $1500 net just that we dont have a loose any money and these job can only be at a time the daycare is open in an area where 50 % only earn a min wage. So we only have to pay for his child yes? Then I dont understand we it got more. Because you cant tell me that you are getting $850 from the state for only one child. You dont understand that, only the first on is his. all other of the 6 are from different men. You wanna kidding me, I even dont have a computer, internet or a TV at home. Because nobody can pay for it and if you wanna know it, we are staying in a overn 40 years old mobile home. Shit and I dont want a whole bunch of money from any guy if I get divorce. I dont see any reason to break anybody just because we are not together anymore. Nobody say he doesnt shall pay anything for his child, but it shouldnt be that much, that his ex makes herself a nice live while we are without anything, like food or sometimes water and energy. That is crazy and unfair. Sorry Cathy but something must going really wrong in your head. And I will tell it you know again, I was wirking my whole live before since Im out of school, but there is now way to work if you have more costs that you can work than you are making. Excuse when I see that wrong, but they have to leave the father enough money to take care of his second family too. And just for you to know to, every time when his ex got another child by another man, my husband had to pay $20 more for his daughter without making more. And you know what, if we get divorced, I could move back to my mom and she was happy to watch her grandchild for free while I´m a work, but right now she stays over 500 miles away. Sorry but with $850 a month for one child ou cant tell me you only support the child. I dont see why you say LOW INCOME and had CHILDREN. He has a average Income where we stay at and I dont see any other children I see only ONE DAUGHTER who is getting more the 3 Person her has to survive, because I will tell it you now again, the gave every of her siblings the some part of the child support he pays for his ONE DAUGHTER. Just as a example he paid $350 before everybody (Mother, 6 children) got an income of $ 50 out of it and now he has to pay more because his daughter has only $50 child support left for her, so he has to pay again though he normally already paid enough. So Cathy why he has to Pay double? Because he pays for every Child of the mother $50 and then again for his OWN daughter. And I will tell it you now again, he has nothing to do with these whole bunch of kids. They are all younger then his ONLY child. Why my husband has to pay now for strangers? He shall pay for his daughter but now for all other kids he has nothing to do with. How is it his fault that the mother gets all the time kids? Plus you really cant expect from me that Im walking first 10 miles to bring my kid to daycare then walking all way to work, walking again back to daycare and then walking home, because here is not public transportation. Then Im walking the whole day plus work, I dont see myself then sleeping for more than 1 hour every day anymore untill I have a car or my child is in school. And that all Im doing then for nothing but maybe §1 more a month.
I cant understand your thinking Cathy. Did a man do you so horrible that all men are that man. Is that what you teach you kids. Its ok to stomp on others as long as your fighting for women. I dont think that women for fought for women rights thought that way. No system is pefect but when a system screw 23% and you dont think reform is needed. Let me share my story. I am a proud father of four, been married faithfully for almost ten years, and have been a veteran since 2009 when i was injured during a deployment. One of my kids, 12 yr old daughter, i pay child support on. But since 2009 i havent been able to work due to injury. With social security and VA claims that take years to solve, im still suppose to make a $358 a month payment when i get just $751. That leaves me with $393 to help take care of 3 kids, house, gas/electric, food, etc. So what did i do. I sent in what i could which was around $285 most months and was still sent to jail. Now lets look at said mother which carries 2 jobs, has 3 kids, and other baby daddy living with her but gets section 8, food stamps, cash assitance, day care vouchers, and medical. so the facts….My daughter with me every weekend, so i have to provide for her then and when she with her mom….now what does mommy provide? idk because with the state paying her rent,food,daycare,insurance and me providing the rest(since have to pay her debt back to state) meanwhile she has 2 brand new cars and just recently got a boob job. So please tell me how this is “in the best interest of the child”. How are states allowed to discrimate on sex when they make laws that unwed couple the mother automaticly get custody and we have to fight tooth and nail just for visitation? Now you tell me honestly that the system dont need reform. First they need to stop coming up with ideas/protocols for all cases when it should be case to case because it may be hard for you to belive but not all men are bad.
Vince,
From what I can read in Cathy’s posts, it wouldn’t matter if your income got reduced to $1 a month. She would still believe the mother is ENTITLED to that original amount. If you can’t physically work then you shouldn’t have made the babies or you would need to go back to school to get a job that can pay the amount without violating your profile! She is something else. You will NEVER get her to admit that some mothers are actually taking advantage of the system, and receiving both child support and government assistance. Truth is about child support, it is in the state’s best interest to seek out and collect child support as they charge a fee on top of the collection costs for each child they collect on. Just imagine how much revenue that generates. There is a need to find deadbeat dads, but there is also a need to take a case by case approach as you articulated to adjust support. The support does not always have to go down in my opinion, but it does needs to be representative of the paying parent’s current financial, marital, and additional children statuses.
My son’s dad owes in excess of $100,000. His arrears isn’t the result of losing a job and falling behind. It is the result of being a cold-hearted criminal. He was always in and out of his life and 7 years ago he abandoned him completely. Changed phone numbers. Moved with no forwarding address. His family would not reveal his whereabouts. He abandoned his son in order to win his ex-wife back.
Prior to the abandonment they had been divorced for about 6 months. She got pregnant by some guy much younger than she was. They came up with the story to tell everyone that they were having a baby and getting back together. Shortly after she got mad and kicked him out again. During this time he was stupid enough to tell me that the child wasn’t actually his and went on to confess that their 2nd child wasn’t his either. At this point he hadn’t paid child supoort in at least 3 years. He kept telling me he couldn’t pay because he was broke, blah blah blah, yet he willingly well provided for that 2nd child who he knew wasn’t his. And here he was again about to claim another man’s kid as his own while he still wasn’t doing jack shit for his only son. I then actively pursued a case against him. No one shits on my son like that and gets away with it. Money was withheld from his checks for about 6 months then they stopped. He had gotten out of the military and it was at this point that the 7 year long abandonment began.
So high school graduation rolls around and guess who had the nerve to show up? Pathetic. His mother had put his name and PO Box on the list of family members for my son to send an announcement to. My son sent him one never expecting him to actually show up. Well shockingly his wife had left him about 3 years prior. In his piss poor apology to me he stated, “I thought if I did all that for her, she would see what a good person I was,”. Really?? I think I blacked out for a second when he said that.
Not only did this “I’m so broke” scum take care of 2 other men’s kids, he also had at least 5 horses. Yes, horses. During the 7 years of searching and investigations I stumbled upon a public social media account for his wife. Picture after picture of their horses. Also found ads online for some horses they had at one time for sale for very large sums of money. Sickening. Criminal.
So where is he today? Good question. My son spent a few weeks with his grandmother that summer after graduation and also spent time with his dad there at her house. That was pretty much it. So much for his apologies to my son huh? His birthday wasn’t long after he was there visitng and his dad never once made an attempt to acknowledge his birthday.
Interestingly though we found out right after all that, that he had gotten back together with his ex..whatever she is. Anytime they split up and he started showing the slightest interest in his son, she couldn’t stand it. She was terrified he might give him a penny. But it seemed she needed her new monogramming business funded and I guess you know he wanted her to see what a “good person” he is.
So to all of the good fathers here who have had actual, valid reasons for falling behind, the criminal I have just told you about and others just like him are the reason fathers like you get screwed so badly when it comes to certain child support issues. I agree there needs to be some kind of reform.
Allow me to give you a different perspective…… My Husband DID not hand her custody. The courts of our state did citing that it is more important to be with the mother than the father. The mother REFUSES to work. During the divorce one of the interrogatories asked if he would be willing to pay for some type of schooling for her and the answer was yes within reason. Now we are in a fight for visitation because SHE refuses to allow him to see his son because I am in the picture. She was awarded $1202 a month in support lives with her sister and REFUSES to find a job or means to support herself and help support their child. So your rant in the above article is one sided. I have seen months where he is struggling to keep up with his bills due to the $1202 a month obligation set forth by the courts. I have seen him go MONTHS without talking to his son because she refuses to allow phone calls or visitation. He also has a 19 month old daughter with me who even if we were separated I would completely allow access to at anytime. I would not care if it were 0300 and he just wanted to see her sleep. The child support system needs reformed. Child support and visitation ARE one issue and let me explain why. Some mothers who obtain child support feel NO obligation to allow the father access and have completely cut the father out of the childs life.
August 2014 we had to force child support in our state to do a accounting of his child support and found that he was ahead in the amount of $3000 due to their accounting errors. The amazing part of this is we took it to the case worker and she said 30 days to handle the situation. Child support has an oversight committee I sent a carefully worded email to the following. My state Senator, My State Congressman, Her Supervisor and the Oversite Committee. We had a response back inside of two days showing we had OVERPAID again let me restate that WE HAD OVERPAID on child support and the District Head even stated for the past year he had been put through the wringer. This email basically went down the food chain and ended up in her lap. Before I did all this I went through the proper channels. I contacted the caseworker multiple times (I say I did simply for the fact he works 12 hours a day 6 days a week in order to make his obligation EVERY month). Child Support can take up to 50% of a parents paycheck in order to support a child. Mothers are now finding family members to live with stating they owe this family member rent and other “Bills” when in fact they are not. This particular case not only is she collecting child support she is also collecting food stamps and medicaid.
Child Support needs reformed and I am working on that. If it takes me the rest of my life I will work on having it equal and child support and visitation as the same thing because it is NOT two separate issues it is one. I am sorry that you have had a bad experience but Do NOT lump in every male with your biased statement. My ex didn’t pay me for three years did I get ticked? Yes I actually did but I took him to court I got my back child support and NOT once did I not allow him visitation.
Explain this one to me. I am a divorced dad. I am medically retired from the military, and physically unable to work. I collect $1980 a month from my retirement check. I am required to pay $950 a month in child support for 2 kids.
Now I get to see my kids on the weekends, so I still have to have the same size house as my ex wife (3 Bedrooms). My ex wife is fully able to work, just doesn’t. So because she refused to work and collect govt. money, my support payments are based on her making minimum wage.
You tell me how I am suppose to survive on $1030 a month, while still needing a 3 bedroom house so I can see my kids 4 days a month. The simple answer is, I cannot, and neither could anyone else. So eventually I will fall behind on my payments and get screwed by the system even more. So yeah, I would say the system needs a little reform.
And just to clarify, I have never missed a payment. The $950 is the real number, not inflated by paying for arrears.
Heres a bit of advice. STOP having so many kids if you cannot support them. You are the reason this country is in such debt. The state and MEN have to pick up the slack that you irresponsible single mothers create! I find it absolutely disgusting how incredibly self-righteous (some/most) women in our society are and their reprehensible behavior regarding having sex and placing “blame” on the man if a pregnancy happens.
“Female non responsibility” is so rampant in our culture, Continuing to force men to pay for a women’s “choice” while not allowing him choice is obviously not working. Sorry to burst your bubble, but it’s ruining children’s lives. Is that your intention? When a woman does not want a child, she aborts, adopts it off, drops it off at a “safe location” or simply throws it in a dumpster and claims post partum.
If the fathers of these children were allowed to take the child and get a child support judgement leveled against her, it would probably make “forgetting to take my pill” a thing of the past.
@ You Are, can’t the same be said to men…”STOP having so many kids?” A woman can’t make a choice of whether to have a child or not until a MAN plants his seed. It would seem to me that the ultimate responsibility lies with you men. If you don’t want to have to pick up the “slack” from some irresponsible woman the, stop making babies.
Until your role is no longer needed in the baby making process you don’t get to go around wagging your finger at “irresponsible women.” If you fear she will forget to take her pill, then zip it up and go home or roll over. Stop those “irresponsible women” in their tracks.
It is within a man’s power to also take responsibility.
Geez, Cathy, that’s a pretty harsh assessment of divorced dads, don’t ya think?
“Child support reform? Not if it means custodial mothers receive less child support than they do now based on state child support guidelines. Not if it means children go without so Dad can have a better lifestyle.”
You mean, better than the poverty-level existence Dad finds himself at without seeing his kids? Yeah, something like that!
Those guidelines are just that–guidelines. A good place to start the discussion at. But when we consider the importance of divorce rulings and their consequences for the children and parents long afterwards, shouldn’t we insist–hell, DEMAND–that it not be some cookie-cutter, stuff-in-and-stuff-out mathematical formula?
Many of the divorces these days are “no-fault”, which usually means “unilateral”. And 70% of the time, those are initiated by the Mom, not the Dad. It’s not the Dad walking out on the Mom and abandoning the kids, yet he’ll be the one bled dry through child support if the Mother wins custody.
The presumption in many courts these days–and it’s only in recent years–is for some type of shared parenting. But not too long ago, if there wasn’t any identifiable fault ground for the divorce, Mom automatically got full custody. So a guy could be the most loving husband and father imaginable, but if the Mom decided she wanted to unilaterally take away his kids and a painful chunk of his income stream, THAT’S FAIR? “Well, that’s the what the formula says, so Dad needs to pay up”?!
Now if the Dad walks out, yes, he deserves to get hit up for child support, and the guidelines are a good basis. But, seriously; it’s fair to rigidly enforce those exact same amounts on a Dad who did no wrong other than marry? I know it’s the child-uber-alles in Family Court and they don’t deserve to be punished, but if a good Dad didn’t want the divorce in the first place he deserves the same financial punishment as the guy who walks out on the wife and kids?
You fail to mention a lot of deadbeat dads are more like dead BROKE dads. The majority of child support arrears are to those at, or below, the federal poverty line. These people would LOVE to be able to make the payment if they could.
The problem with the guidelines is that you can only reduce your spending on essentials–food, clothing, shelter–so much. The result is that the % of income that gets spent on children goes up as the gross income of the combined household goes down, but that is the basis of the guidelines. Someone in the middle class might have to pay, say, 20% of their gross in child support, but the comparable figure for the same number of kids might be 30% or more near the povertly line. You simply can’t get money out of these folks. Nobody who pulls in $1,200/month can afford a $400 child support payment. And guess what? These folks certainly can’t afford lawyers. So they’ll pile up arrears, be unable to modify the amount if they’re unemployed, and end up jail–which, as we all know–WORKS ABSOLUTE FREAKING WONDERS in landing that good-paying job that will allow that guy to pay his current and back child support.
And what of shared parenting? A lot of states have cross-credit child support formulas that offset each parents’ burden based on income and % parenting time. Logic would dictate a 50/50 split in income would involve a (smaller) child support payment if there’s an income differential, and vice versa.
Are you saying the guidelines are fair to say that if Mom and Dad make $50,000/each, and the parenting time splits 55/45 in favor of Mom, that Dad should pay $10,000/yr (~$800/month) in child support, the same as if he had the kid for 0 nights/year instead of 160+? You’re saying its fair he should essentially “double pay” for his kids welfare, once when they’re under his roof and the other when they’re with Mom? Maybe a $100-$250/month payment–but that’s not in the guidelines you emphatically proclaim to be fair.
I really, really think is a part of the law where the pursuit of justice has broken off and taking up permanent residence in the den of intellectual, ethical and mathematicaly laziness. Yes, these are complex situations that should be looked at in their totality and it would take a long time to fully assess each situation.
So. Freaking. What. I’d like to HOPE child support levels are set after a long-drawn out assessment of the situation if folks are paying lawyers $200/hr plus court costs.
Just look at your comment board. There’s a lot of MOMS who know this system’s unfair. That should tell you something.
wow if you aren’t gender biased!….yes BOTH parents should be responsible for taking care of the children. The problem here is “corporate” america has stuck their greedy hands in between the mother and father involved. Why should a bunch of state funded goofs be allowed to dictate to either parents an amount of money,how often (or not often) a parent can see there child,how or when they can see them?etc…if you do even a little bit of internet searching you will find page after page of the corrupted doings of the people involved with the “system”. I have personally dealt with these scumbags and am aware firsthand of the science they have made it just to have a relationship with a child.(of course with the sole intention of the child/childrens best interest-BULLSHIT).Go sign the many petitions listed online,this is a slavery and has not much too do with the happiness of the child/children who have been placed in the “system” thanks to one parent or the other (although we all know what gender it USUALLY is).I will not follow there rules as i didn’t make the rules nor did i ever sign any contract that i can remember to say i would bow down to them.Mom’s and Dad’s-do yourselves and your child or children a favor and keep your child/children out of the system,petition to congress to abolish this slavery,ignore what they tell you and think about the kids instead of the dollar amount.
Any woman thinking of getting married and having children should spend a couple of days in family court first. It won’t take a woman long to see what is happening now. The Father’s rights movement is trying to turn Mothers into unpaid surrogates and nannies. The women in court once thought they knew the man they made a child with, but they didn’t. A sperm donor at $600 and a Dr’s visit is cheaper than a custody battle that can run from $10,000 to $100,000+. Deadbeat Dads masquerade as caring fathers. You can usually tell who they are because they are the most vocal in their demands for a 50%/50% time share, if self-employed they lie about their income and send the police to the Mother’s house on every trumped up excuse possible. Was Lincoln’s Day really meant to be Lincoln’s Day the school holiday? Oh, I thought it was Lincoln’s Birthday the day that isn’t a school holiday. Their goal is to get out of paying child support or to get it flowing to them. They won’t spend the child support money on the children, so they assume a woman wouldn’t either. Of course they want receipts, just so they can claim it is all overspending or frivolous and not pay it. Their attitude is why should a child need more than two pairs of shorts, shirts, socks and underwear. They’ll just outgrow them next season anyway. My Ex refused to pay childcare costs based on the excuse the childcare provider wouldn’t have been his choice. This after our son was kicked out of childcare and this was the only provider who would take him and when his approval of the childcare provider wasn’t a requirement. I only had to inform him of the childcare provider’s information.
The fact that a woman spends 9 months making the baby doesn’t matter anymore, but it should matter. We did not have children for the benefit of the man. Making a baby is hard work and takes a toll on a woman’s body. If a man wants to know what it is like to make a baby, he should put on a respirator that restricts oxygen by 25%, throw up every morning for 6 weeks (or feel like he has to), strap 25% of his body weight to his stomach changing his center of gravity out 9 inches and do this 24/7 for 2 months followed by childbirth. For a man to understand childbirth he would need to apply the output of a 12V car battery to his scrotum 30 seconds on/2 minutes off for 12 hours, pass a grapefruit through his rectum which would cause tearing and require stitches and the associated itching and swelling (all of which would constitute torture under the Geneva Conventions). Add to that stretch marks, stretched abdominal muscles and possibly stress incontinence for life. Yet men believe this is of no consequences because they didnt’ feel a thing.
A few days in family court would make using a sperm donor look like a better alternative to knowing their child’s father.
Debora, I agree with some of what you say, disagree with some. Some men have fallen victim to the rhetoric thrown around by the “father’s rights” movement and to the detriment of their children. I’ve stopped approving comments because it is the same old argument over and over again. A man who loves his children doesn’t make negative noise about being responsible for those children. It’s men who have lost control over a woman who make negative noises about having to support their children. They can’t separate their relationship and responsibility for their children from the woman who left the. To get back at her they deny their children what is rightfully theirs…love and financial support. I don’t, however agree that mothers have more rights that fathers just because they carried and gave birth to a child. In my opinion that objectifies a child and turns it into an argument about ownership instead of parenting. The focus, by both mothers and fathers should be on loving and being responsible for our children instead of hating each other. I don’t see much of that is discussions like this online.
How can the best place for a child to be, be with the person who needs money in order to provide? If my daughter lived with me I could keep my 1500 a month and her mom would not have to pay me child support and she could come see our child whenever she pleases…I just dont get that part of Child support….I made a child regardless of if i stay married or not its your responsilibty to provide for the child you created, not just the father but BOTH parents should have to make the same effort
Simply, This is an absolutly, terribly written article. I’m disgusted to even read it. I’m sorry but our society today values things over relationships. The problem with Family court and why it is so overloaded is because of unfair Child support laws. Try to be on the other side Cathy, then you can make comments of how Father’s who complain about the unfairness of Child support are just selfish. I completely disagree with arrearages. once that time has passed, why should a father be kept in debt. There is more than one simple explanation for arrearages than simple (He was a deadbeat and didnt pay). Some father’s never knew they had a child, Many pay for children that aren’t even theirs (And are forced to continue paying). Sometimes court desicsion take so long, that arreages can become very dabilitating and add a few hundred dollars a month. And Many women take advantage of the laws. I know many women who stay home, because they get a bigger check from daddy if they don’t work. There are MAJOR issues with Child support, It is what drives people to family court to fight over visitation. Your article Disgusts me.
I’m on the side of children. I have no problem supporting my child. However, I do think it is odd that so many women — including you, Cathy — are against the idea of custodial parents keeping track of how child support is used. I’m self-employed… I have to keep receipts for everything. It is really not that difficult to do. The custodial parent could send that info in monthly or perhaps annually. Can you explain why you are against the idea?
We know that some custodial parents abuse the support for their children — just as some non-custodial parents refuse to pay even when they can. Anyone who denies that is a fool or is conveniently looking away from the problem. Yet when this topic is brought up a lot of people instantly act as though ALL custodial parents are saints. That is simply not the case. If you truly care about ‘the children’ you should want to know tha the children caught in these situations are truly being served by both parents.
I just don’t understand why custodial parents get bent out of shape when the idea of keeping tabs on how the support is used is brought up. After all, if they are not using the money on other children, on themselves or to buy someone other than the child a gift… what is the problem? I don’t think it is an issue unless the custodial parent has something to hide — OR knows that a law like that would likely result in thousands, if not millions, of custodial parents losing custody if they keep their bad habits after it is passed (which would likely spur massive reform in the process – making the chance of receiving custody more fair). So what is the issue? You tell me.
Is it fair for the child if her custodial parents uses support for a night of drinking at the club? Is it fair for the child if his custodial parent uses support to buy another child in the household birthday gifts? Is it fair for the child if his or her custodial parent uses support to help bail another adult out of jail? Situations like that happen. Child support is abused by some custodial parents. It should stop. Just as non-cusodial parents refusing to pay should stop. If you disagree… it is clear that that you really don’t care about all of these kids caught in the system.
Brian, yes, I’m against having to answer to someone about how I spend my money. Child support, once it leaves the father’s hands, belongs to the mother to provide for her children. There is no moral or legal reason she should be held accountable to a man she either no longer wanted to be married to or, one that left her.
If a father feels his child support is not being spent on the child he has the family court to use as an outlet. He can always file a petition and have the issue resolved in court.
No custodial parent should have to keep a receipt for every penny of child support they spend on their child. Should I have saved a receipt for every piece of bubble gum or candy I purchased for my children out of child support. How about every notebook or school supply? Ridiculous!
If my ex had wanted an accounting of where every penny was spent that would have left me open to abusive emails from him about how I spent MY money. It would have been another opportunity for him to use our children and their needs to beat me up. The family court is not going to put a custodial parent in that position, thank God.
If a custodial parent is not properly spending child support and the child is doing without, that is going to be evident whether or not a non-custodial parent has an accounting of how every penny is spent. If a non-custodial parent witnesses their child doing without, like I said before, they can hire a lawyer and use the courts to protect their children.
Bottom line, the belief by some men that a divorced mother should have to account to them for how she spends HER money is nothing but an attempt or desire by men to regain control where they no longer have any…over the woman he is pissed with.
Pay attention to your children. If they are doing without what they need take rational steps to rectify the problem and stop making irrational suggestions that gives you more control than you have a right to.
Custodial parents (no matter whether they are mothers or fathers) should not have to waste their precious time compiling and organizing every single receipt just so the non-custodial parent can see that money is being spent on the kids. Kids have a tendency to nickel and dime parents, especially if they are Teenagers. Responsible Custodial parents don’t have time to waste on nit-picking expenses like non-custodial parents because they are too busy actually raising their children, and trying to financially support them.
I’ll add that keeping up with child support payments can be difficult depending on individual situations. When my ex left me for another man I was left with debt that we had both allowed to happen. I was foolish. I let her use credit cards and all that jazz. It was in my name — so it was my burden to pay. The courts don’t look at debt. They don’t care.
The first two years were hard. I barely had enough money for food and fuel after paying on the credit card debt and sending my support in. I didn’t want to get behind in payments. I got through it, but I can see how other men or women may have gave up long before that. It took me 5 years to finally pay off the debt we had both caused. Let’s just say that I learned to not be so trusting of women. I def’ learned to stay away from credit cards. Ha, ha.
The courts do look at debt. Coming to a decision about how marital debt will be split is part of every divorce, if there is marital debt. If you ended up paying all the marital debt you did so because you had a bad attorney or, you didn’t do your research about divorce and make sure your legal rights were protected. Divorce is a financial burden on anyone who goes through it. The burden is just as great for custodial parents as it is for non-custodial parents. It’s a shared burden. I could tell some horror stories about what the first 5 years after divorce was like for myself and my children. And, I was working full time and receiving child support. There were plenty of times I counted change and crossed my fingers I had enough to buy a gallon of milk. My ex, on the other hand, was buying horses and taking vacations to Portugal. Being left destitute after divorce isn’t a gender issue, it is a divorce issue. It’s too bad you’ve chosen to allow what one women did cause you to lose trust in all women. You need to rethink that position.
No they don’t look at Debt Cathy, you as always are misinformed. The courts only look at relative income, and they usually ignore evidence of income by the payee in order to maximize TitleIV matching payments.
Child support absolutely needs reform. I believe the only people disagreeing with that thought are the women who pocket the checks and use them on their own wants.
I have only read two posts and can already tell you’re a divorced woman who thinks she is owed everything. I have one thing to say about divorced women … unless your husband literally just up and left you without a word … YOU MADE THE CHOICE to get divorced. I don’t care what he was doing that made your world so incredibly horrible … and there are some horrible things … but it still comes down to you making a choice to get out of a marriage that you weren’t happy in. Deal with it. Move on. Nobody owes you anything. If your husband was jerk enough to “warrant” your divorce, then be happy you no longer have to deal with him. Just be happy. Stop trying to take everything in the world from him. He should not be responsible to support your new house and your new family and your new spending habbits just because you no longer want to work on your marriage with him or because you “need” to get away from him or because he no longer loves you. Child support is in place for children. Not mothers. And you should absolutely be accountable for what it is spent on. It is NOT yours! Seriously. Take responsibility for your choices.
Airi, you said a lot about what women should do after divorce before getting to the subject matter…child support. It it is mothers who care for the children the majority of the time, it is mothers who will be responsible for how that child support is spent on the child. Like I said in an earlier comment, if you have reason to believe money is not being spent on your child, use the family court as a recourse. It really is that simple.
Custodial parents (no matter whether they are mothers or fathers) should have to waste their precious time compiling and organizing every single receipt just so the non-custodial parent can see that money is being spent on the kids. Kids have a tendency to nickel and dime parents, especially if they are Teenagers. Responsible Custodial parents don’t have time to waste on not-picking expenses like non-custodial parents because they are too busy actually raising their children.
Cathy will never understand anything. She lives in her bubble where mothers are the only parent capable of taking care of children, and feels she should be court ordered to do so. Here is my take on the situation Cathy; if you cannot afford to provide an adequate living on your own for your children, the judge should have every right to give the father a chance to do the same if he is willing. Your problem is you live in the 1700s and we are now in 2015!
Edward Moore, sorry but your assumptions about me and what I feel or believe are wrong. If you had done your research, you would know that. I am a proponent of shared/equal parenting time after divorce. My ex was offered 50?50 custody and he turned it down. Children need both parents engaged in their lives from the moment they are born. That is just common sense. You are muddying the waters. Child custody and child support are two different issues. And, judges do have every right to grant father’s custody of their children. If more fathers sought custody, more fathers would be given custody. As for the “if you can’t provide an adequate living” statement, well if a man has no problem providing for his children before divorce, he should have no problem helping to support them after divorce. More of the common sense thing. And a bit of moral and ethical behavior thrown in.
Cathy-
A few quick questions. You seem to have a very strong and powerful opinion about what you are owed. As a modern single mother for 3, I am perplexed why.
1. My response, the one that finally left him stopped his complaints, “You’ll live a hell of a lot better lifestyle than your children.”- So you, as a woman with two hands and a brain, cannot contribute to your children’s lifestyle with your ex-husband to improve it? It is in his hands. Are you helpless to provide? If he does not give YOU money, YOU cannot create a lifestyle for your children in any way?
2. Not if it means custodial mothers receive less child support than they do now based on state child support guidelines. Not if it means children go without so Dad can have a better lifestyle.- Again, do you have ownership of this man just because you were once married? What are YOU doing to make sure he has 50% of shared parenting and only 50% of the costs of parenting. What are YOU doing to be an adult?
My question is- do you currently try to make as much money as your ex-husband? Why not? Why are you writing articles like this when you could take that same (anger) creativity and harness it towards something that shows your children how to create a lifestyle and income, rather than be entitled to money from someone else.
You sound like an entitled woman who believes that men should provide for you whatever you want. This is the viewpoint of a child, not an adult woman.
As a woman, you embarass me. I am a single mom working full-time to MATCH what my ex-husband brings to the table. Not to prove a point, but because I see myself as an EQUAL HUMAN.
Stop complaining and get to work.
I am not against child support, but it is definitely time that the reform happens. Obligors are being drained and most of the time it’s not fair. This is what needs to be done…
– All alleged fathers are to be tested for paternity, regardless of signing a birth certificate or marriage.
– Paternity testing will be paid for by the party requesting child support.
– Once paternity is established, both parties are to be mediated to establish custody, starting with shared custody and 50/50 visitation.
The amount of time each parent has with the child will predict the amount of child support if applicable. If there is a 50/50 custody then no support will be rendered to either parent.
This is what they need to do across the board. You will still have your deadbeat obligors, but why should honest obligors suffer? Child support has become a multi billion dollar agency that don’t even care about your chilrdren.
If they did care, they would make sure that the father had equals rights in the beginning, and if he jacks them off then handle it accordingly. All the system care about is finding an obligor so they can get their 2-4% cut off top that they get with every case. I’m still waiting to see a dollar bill of any denomination get up off the table and support a child. Also, there are studies and stats that shows proof that children do better when fathers are in their lives. Why would you take this away from a child? Shows proof that the courts do not care.
I absolutely love this article. It has a clear plain message. Any of those who would see it for anything else are jaded. I am a mom who has raised two children now for over 10 years without support from their birth father. Yes I made the decision to have children with that man and yes I have stood up to those responsibilities emotionally, physicaly and financially. We do have a current support order which their birth father has chosen to ignore. He has also chosen to ignore his opportunity to be a part of their lives. He has been chased from California to New York and back to California. He currently owes approximately 170k in back child support, and is paying $200/month to keep a valid license in California. (Not even the court ordered amount!) He has requested a modification which I am not opposed to however the court has been asking him for the past two years to provide proof of income. He has refused and found every excuse why not to provide any documentation or payment of the arrears. I have been documenting all my expenses in raising my two children for the last 10 plus years. Recently I encountered a new website http://www.supportpay.com/ which helps to track payments and expenses. I am going back to court next week. Please wish me luck!
Nikki … As you stated, you’ve been capable of living without his money for 10 years. If you wanted his financial support, you should have stayed where your relationship entitled you to it. As you are no longer together, you ‘deserve’ nothing. Should he support his kids? Of course. But is he obligated to YOU? Not for a second. And if he chooses to let his kids go without it, that’s his choice.
If you’ve survived and supported the kids on your own for 10 years, then you can certainly survive without him. Trying to make your ex husband pay at this point is clearly for YOU! Not the kids! Just move on. Find out what it’s like to really be free from him. Everyone will be happier.
There are several problems with current child support laws.
1st is a women can have an abortion it’s her body her right to doit or not and I agree. Now what if the father had the option to give up his parenting rights in the first couple months of pregnancy in exchange to pay none or a reduced payment? That may change things a bit.
I should state that I do not pay any child support. I may or may not have a child though. I am waiting on the DNA test. In the hospital the nurses asked me 3-times in front of the mom if I signed the declaration of paternity fomr and went on and on about the “advantages”. I didn’t sign it because the one disadvantage (which not one nurse ever said” is you then have a short clock in which to dispute it in court if you find out you aren’t the father. After that your stuck. 18 years of payments for another person’s child is servitude.
The he most common argument is how the child is innocent and shouldn’t have to suffer. That’s utter BS. First, someone who isn’t the father should have the option not to care about another persons child. Second the guy may have not had actual genetic kids of his own effectively making his line extinct. What about the unborn genetic related children’s rights? Few stories make me sicker to read than when a couple split up the guy finds out the truth he isn’t the father, and has to pay. Meanwhile the mom gets together with the genetic father enjoying that third stream of income.
Third I have known several people who have paid support. God help them If they lose there jobs and/or take a cut in pay. It’s multiple court visits and money to a lawyer to try and get the support adjusted. Let them get a better job and the mom has to mention it to the county and they are all over upping his requirement.
4th if someone has more than one kid by different dads, one father often pays far more than the rest. Which means they are paying for other peoples children.
5th visitation and fathers rights often get violated. Again it’s a lengthy and expensive process for the father to fight these things.
6th how does taking away a guys license help them pay? That just hinders options to make money.
And lastly if the father makes that much more than the mother, and often has the same amount of “free time”, why doesn’t the child love with them? Wouldn’t it make more sense tI have the kid live where the money comes from? They may learn how to be more self sufficient of they did.
That all said, you have a kid that is genetically yours and later on things don’t work out between the parents so be it. The 2 parents relationship has nothing to do with your child. You did the deed to have a kid now do the deed to take care of them. I fully think fathers and mothers should step up to the plate and do what they can to raise the child and provide for them.
That doesn’t dismiss Anyone like Nikki saying “Any of those who would see it for anything else are jaded. ” sorry Nikki easy to say something like that when the decks stacked entirely in your favor. Fair is fair and right is right. the parent paying support shouldn’t have to be enslaved by the system. I protected my butt and don’t have any children I am supposed to pay support on. I know what I see though when looking at others. Right now the child support laws are seriously flawed.
I think you are only seeing your situation and thinking it’s that way across the board! I believe every man SHOULD be responsible for his children just as much as the mother. I dont believe they should get a clean break and help with nothing HOWEVER it does need reformed. I’m married so someone who has children previously with someone else. She has not worked one day of her life but will be the first to complain when the kids need something. She has babysitters coming out the wazoo and has no issue finding one to go out but just can’t HELP financially with her own children . She sits on her butt with her hand out BECAUSE SHE CAN. All she has to do is say hey I’m a single mom and she gets a nice chunk of his money and buys herself the world while his kids run around in old clothes that look like pajamas. If u honestly think for one second “filing a petition” does him good your insaine. He is to write down a list of bills debt etc and he uses the paper to doodle on! She is not asked to work or help at all falls on him. Like I said at the beginning I don’t agree he should get away clean but he is making up for the lack she chooses to do and gets away with it. Not every situation is like yours and because of that something does need to happen .
The one thing I can say, with all sincerity, is that child support guidelines are fair. No father is going broke due to a child support order. He may go broke because he is in arrears…has not kept up with his child support and is having to pay the state back plus interest. If so, that is his problem, not his child’s problem and no child should have to pay for bad choices Dad made.
“No father is going broke due to a child support order.”
Oh, really? This is is a LIE.
Tell me how you will live a life that is good enough to be able to take your child out in your few hours of scheduled parenting time when you make $14/hour, and are paying 37% of your before tax income to child support in a state wiht state income tax. Explain this to me. Oh, and, you have diabetes, were never even in a serious relationship with the mother of the child, and she has chosen cadillac child care, because she was 34 and afraid she would never have a kid. She had the choice to bring the child into the world, despite the father’s wishes, and knew that she would get a 40% stipend. She basically avoided paying for a sperm donor, and knew she could get support for 19 years. The man in question LOVES his daugher and wants to to see her, but can’t even afford insulin and old medical bills. Tell me how a man who is considering filing for bankruptcy is not BANKRUPT. You are a ridiculious, biased, idiot.
I have three kids by three different women. I am not happy about that, but it is not the child’s fault!! Each of the moms went to DHS in Oklahoma and I was ordered to pay child support. I agree with me having to pay since I helped in the conceving of the children. The problem I have is my oldest daughter’s mom has ran me through the ringer since day 1!! It was a one night stand that I do not remember, but when I hired an attorney to help me on the case, he did not notify me that I was to appear in court and he did not show either. I got slapped with owing $1,000 in current support plus a total of $6,000 in back support. I only made $6.00 per hour in 1997. Since then, I have paid child support and it accures intrest each month which makes me feel like I am financing my child. Her mom has wanted me to go to court every 6 months knowing good and well that I pay it because it comes out of my check each pay period.
When I found out about the third child, I sent a proposal to ALL three moms asking if they would take 50% of my check after taxes and spit it three ways, (I only see my middle son because hs mom and I were together for three years and the other two will not let me see the child) but I OWE each mom child support. The oldest daughter’s mom did not agree with this proposal when the other two did and it cost me to lose EVERYTHING I owned, apartment, car, and even my job because I could not get to work. DHS even put my picture on their “Most Wanted” list on their website when I WAS paying child support on ALL three cases.
If a father has multiple cases of child support and he proposes to take 50% of his check after taxes and split it, they should do it!! A father has a right to make a living just as much as the mother and also has the obligation, not a choice, to pay child support on the child he helps concieve. But not let the mom cost him everything when she is living in her $150,000, 4 bedroom home and her boyfriend living with her. It’s not right at all!!!
I always wonder where are all these men breaking their neck to pay child support but still not catching a break? These stand up men that are heart wrenchingly victimized by the system to the point of poverty. I mean we hear about these men ALL the time, let them tell it this exists in the majority of all child support cases. At such a land slide that we need a reform. Right?
But where are all these men, because I’ve never met one. I can certainly say it doesn’t exist in my case. My case where being the primary caregiver means your finances don’t get “options” like a non-custodial father. where yor debts don’t get a “break” because everyday you are investing into the well being of your child. Health, schooling, extra-curricular programs, birthday parties, rent/mortgage, food, clothes, misc kids stuff that (low and behold) cost money.
Again this is just my own experience but I receive $500/month to cover all of this. Lol, I laugh every time I think about it. I live in California! Where oh where can you even find child care for $500/month let alone pay for all the additional crap that us horrible , lazy, money sucking mothers have to cover?
Lets be real…. Whether a woman is lazy or not, men don’t pay nearly enough to cover the basic necessities for a child, which means us moms have to supplement from somewhere else. No one asks how or even if we can, we just have to because we don’t have any other options. Father’s don’t have enough money, your license gets suspended and your slapped with a seek work order. Oh how horrible. What do you think happens to mom when she can’t cover the rest of what your whiny butt can’t pay? Food gets reduced, bills go unpaid, worse case scenario child gets taken away or sent to dad (who most likely would have the nerve to ask for child support themselves.) Funny how it works.
So no, child care reform to reduce child support doesn’t work for me because our current child support doesn’t provide enough for those taking on the majority of the financial responsibility to begin with.
However, maybe providing receipts and requiring fathers to pay half of every receipt you have pertaining to your child might be something to look into. Don’t be surprised though if men start paying a lot more than their current calculated minimum.
They’re working that’s where they are. That’s why you don’t see them because they’re working 16 to 20 hour days.
I hear you. My ex is suppose to pay me $50 a week ($200 a month) for our two kids. Well this month was the first month he had his wage garnished and I received $89.59 for the whole month. When I called and asked why I didn’t get the full amount (which is laughable at that) they tell me he didn’t work enough and they can only take a max percent out of his pay. He lives at his mothers and has no bills. Meanwhile I have to pay rent, utilities, and all the care for my kids. I would love to give him recipits so he would pay half. I currently spend $50-100 a day on my kids between food, clothes, toys, extra curricular activities, and school bills. My calculation that equals around $1000 a month for his share. Much more than the 200 the court says he only has to pay, or the $89 that I actually only received. Thank goodness we have government assistance to keep us afloat because can’t count on dead to do that. And yes it is sad that tax payers have to pay because their father won’t and refuses to get a job cause it would mean he would have to pay more.
so sad women get so much government assistants on top of that child support to have a child is like a gold mine I have 2kids and one on the way my first child’s mother is wonderful I see my daughter pay for anything she needs with no prob my 2nd child’s mother is bitter and and hateful makes it impossible to see my child puts me on child support to be spitefull doesn’t work and makes excuses that she has my son so she can’t I say let me get him she replays with hell no she gets Medicaid food stamps the whole nine what do I get have to pay 20% of my check i have to work more hours to keep up with bills less time with my wife and kids even if I were to get a better paying job or promotion it wouldn’t matter they will just take more what kind of logic is that what changed nothing lol I have to pay back the Medicaid and struggle everday to provide for my family and it’s sad while she stays with her parents like I said get government assistance and child support it is nothing more than a weapen to get back at there husband or boyfriend for whatever the reason on another note my mom had three kids didn’t collect child support or government assistance and did alot more with her life than waste taxpayers money she is a strong and independent woman there are people who do actually need these things and can’t even get it because of people abusing the system so quit beating up on men because there is a lot of good ones out there
First of all I’m pleasantly surprised at how many dads are signed up/logged into a divorced moms forum to stand up for father’s rights. Bravo gentlemen… bravo. *hat tip* Judging by most of the posts there seem to be a lot of bitter parents posting which is probably not health for you or your child. I’d be willing to guess most of you (not all) would rather be posting about your parenting situation on this page rather than posting to an infertility page but if not your motives as a parent are probably questionable.
So to describe me, I’m a happily divorced (as Louis CK said, “No one ever says their divorce is falling apart”) father of a 4 year-old little boy and share 50/50 custody with his mom. I always wanted a little boy to share the more masculine aspects of life with (tools, snakes, frogs, baseball, etc) and I was lucky enough to be granted the chance. Unfortunately (fortunately) less than a year after my son was born my marriage was ending and my ex had plans to relocate her (and my son) to live in her parents’ house an hour away. Regardless of how I was as a father during marriage I was labeled inept the minute she walked out the door. All the nights I stayed up bottle feeding him, regardless of having a full-time job (she was a staying at home “trying to find a job”) were for naught. She could take the house, she could take the car but she wasn’t taking my little boy *papers served* To make a long story short I spent two years in a lengthy/costly/emotional custody battle and the end result was what we had agreed to in the first place when we separated (which didn’t include relocating my son). My ex and I spent years walking on egg shells around each other constantly wondering how the other person would use what was being said or done in court. In the end we were both able to put the hard feelings behind us and be civil to each other which is much better than holding in all that animosity. We now exchange our days with him freely without worrying about the repercussions, discuss medical decisions, participate in his birthday together and even spend some holiday mornings such as Christmas together. Is a reconciliation in the future, Never, but in the end it’s not about us it’s about him.
So child support, what is a fair amount? I make three times as much as my ex and because of the state formula it leaves me with the entire burden/privilege of his care (roughly 1500 a month for preschool, health insurance, medical expenses, etc). For a long time this was a hard pill to swallow especially since I was living paycheck to paycheck and she was living paycheck to new car, paycheck to new clothes, paycheck to vacation, paycheck to nail salon, paycheck to hair stylist. I think this is what chaps the a** of most parents who have to pay and don’t get paid. It’s like the bar is only equal if both parents are equally suffering financially. Personally I just remind myself if I was still married I’d still be paying for those things for him regardless.
While I try to find the positive in my custody issues I do find many things wrong with the system. The old school mentality of the woman carried the child for 9 months it (somehow) makes the woman a more qualified parent. While I realize there are probably many exceptions, a lot of us men spent that time catering to our partners needs/emotions and put in an equal effort for the arrival of their newborn. It’s also very disturbing the treatment of men v. women in regards to child support non-payment. If a man doesn’t pay or can’t afford to pay they are demonized and can expect jail time where as a woman not paying rarely results in jail time and she is portrayed as a victim. I also find the mentality “he should have known better and not done the deed” sickening. If you’re on your sixth child with six different men and couldn’t afford the first five, you’re not a victim, you’re a free loader working the system.
Too many smart people have already pointed out the corruption and unfairness of the existing child support system. I don’t need to repeat all the same points. Learn how Cathy Meyer has no clue what she is talking about.
Child Trafficking American Style: How Cash-for-Kids exists and how to Stop Ithild Trafficking American Style: How Cash-for-Kids exists and how to Stop It
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7B4EJcc8J8EC
Great Article. Thanks for the info. Does anyone know where I can find a blank Child Support Guidelines Form to fill out?
OK … so I pay child support despite having the kids 50% of the time. I work two jobs to maintain my household and subsidize another. In six months I will be mandatorily retired from one job that provides 20% of my income and will not receive any retirement benefits for 10 years.
Meanwhile, my ex-wife, whom I have been apart from for 5+ years, has decided to put herself through undergrad and now a masters degree. What’s worse is the choice of study, Art Therapy, is a questionable profession to pursue in today’s economy. She has no income of her own. Because of her choices, the kids live on child support and government subsistence when with her. When with me, we do better, but not by much (without the government aid).
After I lose my job in six months, I will no longer be able to pay child support and the mortgage in the home the children were born in. FYI, the home is a modest 3 bedroom house in the suburbs. Meanwhile, my ex-wife has moved 3 times in years.
Exactly where is it in the children’s best interest to lose the only steady home where my ex-wife refuses to work?
I’m going to echo some of Chris’ thoughts from below:
I have three children with my wife, one whom is disabled. On paper I do ok. Money is tight. We have one of the cheapest homes in our city, and drive a 10 yr old and 2 yr old car.
An ex-gf popped up last year and says surprise you have a 14 year old! Guess what? She wants: – full table support aka 16% of my take home pay
– extraordinaty expenses in excess of what my wife and I pay on our 3 kids
– me to pay 50% of the child’s post-secondary education, when we get there
– they live in a city 500km away (300miles) so exercising access is going to cost me
– if I don’t exercise access because I can’t afford it, any future court procedures will label me a deadbeat
I can understand that this is in her child’s best interest but taking that much out of the hands of three other children the right way to do it. I’ve never known about the child, nor had time to prepare for this fiscally?
When I dated this ex, she made about $1,000 less than me annually. Since then she has moved on to taking a jobs that pay cash. She now reports 15k in annual income, expenses of 65k annually, and absolutely no debt.
There is no justice…
Get a job lady!!!! If the parents have shared parenting and have equal time with the children WHY ON EARTH would one parent have to pay the other?!?! And on top of that, if you are the reason they cant see the children as much as they would like because you fought them on it, then maybe you should be able to support them…. Or give them to the parent that can. Wake up!!! You didnt make that child by yourself and EVERYTHING should be split down the middle. INCLUDING equal parenting time!!!! People like YOU are the problem.
As long as the person receiving the support has a adult cost of living scenario run against them and they have to prove they on their own make enough money to support themselves….. Then I honestly believe that most parents who pay the calculated child support would not have an issue. What normally annoys the payor is when the person receiving the income has no personal or extremely limited income of their own….it’s obvious how they are getting by in life. They are STEALING from their children.
Bob,
I agree. My husband pays child support to his ex wife for her two kids and I don’t have a problem with that. He pays 33% and no matter what her income was he would still be paying that 33%, rightly so. However, once they divorced she quit her job and now lives solely off of his child support. The child support guidelines for our state actually says that BOTH parents have a financially responsibility to support their children. S, where is her portion? If she has no income, not only is she NOT contributing financially to their support, she is also supporting herself on their money. They go without a lot of things when they are with her because she doesn’t have enough money. She always tells them to ask their father if they want things. I don’t think this is right. That money should be for them and to take care of them. I feel like every time she gets a fancy hair cut or gets her nails done she is essentially stealing from them! It’s disgusting.
This article is trash.
As a father that has raised a son on my own, and have another son that lives with his mom I can see both sides. For my oldest son I had to give up child support so I could have custody. Fighting for him in court would not have been in my favour after consulting with lawyers. The courts don’t like to separate children from their mom and siblings, even in cases where a sibling is abusive. With my second son, his mom got pregnant for the sole purpose of an income. In his 11 years she has at most worked very part time, living off the child support from him and another child she collected support from. I am responsible for his support and for access when he lives 2 hours away from me. I know here in Canada at least, the child custody and support laws are sexually biased, so yes I believe we need to reform the system here.
I’ve been reading the guys comments, and commend them for speaking out. I am a single mom who gave up ten years of my career in order to give my two boys a good start. I resumed my career when my youngest was 6. My ex husband always made a pretty good income. He also liked to spend it. Post-divorce he is an extremely bitter person, and did whatever was possible to get child support initially at zero (claimed he wanted 50-50 custody, then after divorce went thru, didn’t take the boys). Then, after going thru the expense of dragging him back to court for child support, he did whatever he could to get it to as cheap a level as possible, all with the help of his expensive attorney, and his parents also helping him pay attorney. I, on the other hand, could barely scrape together a retainer to afford an attorney to take him back to court for not upholding parenting. It’s not that I don’t work, it’s that raising kids is expensive. And while he sat back and enjoyed pampering himself with expensive boy toys (Hummer H2 in garage and ski boat, redecorate house, new electronics, etc… His boys and I are left struggling. my point, this is not a mom or dad problem. This is a problem where whoever has the money, is narcissistic and spiteful, holds all the cards. I’ve known mothers who do the same as some dads. Our legal system stinks all around, and is totally slanted in favor of those who can afford to be in it.
Lack of empathy is the hallmark of the sociopath. All of Ms. Meyer’s articles are virulently anti-male, and completely one-sided. Her contempt for men is clear. The lack of any pretense of objectivity, or even a scintilla of compassion for the male perspective, is truly disturbing. It’s truly unfortunate that this woman has been given a platform to spew her hatred. This is why families continue to suffer.
This comment is in response to one left by a guy yesterday accusing me of only responding to comments that agree with my opinion. Not true! This article has over 100 comments. Many who agree with me, many who don’t. I’ve not commented here in months because I have a life, a job, friends and family and I don’t spend my time eagerly awaiting the opportunity to argue with someone about an opinion I’ve already stated in the article. If I were only interested in comments that validate my opinion, I would delete comments that didn’t. If I don’t respond to a comment someone leaves it isn’t because they don’t agree with me, it’s because I’m working and living my life.
I can see that you took the time to read my post carefully…I am a woman, not a guy. Also, I didn’t accuse you of only responding to comments that validate your opinion, I accused you of only responding to comments that you can easily answer, or use to validate your opinion. As for you having a life, job, friends and family that keep you too busy to respond…well perhaps you should not waste your time or anyone else’s writing articles that clearly deserve debate, unless you are willing to spend the time to participate. Furthermore, I too have a life, a job, children and friends, but I took the time to read your opinion on the subject; I’m sorry if my pointing out that you seem to ignore those who have reasonable objections to your opinion hit a nerve. You’ll forgive me if I don’t believe your excuse for not responding is because you were busy…you managed to read and respond to the 4 or 5 comments made directly after mine, which were all of course written by men who obviously fit the stereotype of the bitter complaining father who is just angry at his ex. Like I said before, I was sincerely looking for an honest opinion about a situation that doesn’t fit that stereotype, and what your proposed solution would be, if not reform?
Cori, before the 13th it had been over 6 months since I had commented on this article. I didn’t respond to any comments directly after the one you left. I’ve written hundreds of articles over the past 9 years. Am I supposed to regularly visit all those articles and make sure that I’m engaging in debate? Is it really your opinion that, on top of writing, I am to make sure that readers also are given my time so they can “debate” with the writer? I don’t owe you or anyone else a debate or engagement of any kind. You are not in a position of telling me what I should be willing to do or not do. It is 1:18am on a Sunday morning and I’ve taken the time, instead of ending another work day, to advise you of something you don’t seem to understand…no writer OWES you anything, Cori. If you need a solution from someone you believe owes you something, go pay someone for their time.
Well thank you for your time Cathy, but I have to respectfully disagree. You are writing articles about topics that deserve conversation. In fact, the very title of your article asked a question that apparently you did not want an answer to. It is not as though you wrote a novel and I was offended that you don’t respond to every fan letter…you are engaging an audience on a forum meant to foster this type of conversation, as I am sure you are aware. And it is not as though you didn’t have tie to respond or participate. You did. You just seemed to ignore those who had valid arguments for the need for reform. You did participate and respond to comments after I wrote mine in December. You replied to many after that. You may not owe me anything, but if you really care about indingva resolution to this problem, I would hope that you could keep an open mind and consider all sides of the argument, not just those that agree with your own.
Sorry Cathy. You do in fact, delete posts. You deleted mine from a day ago. Perhaps now is a time for you to have a moment of honesty on all fronts.
Your sweeping generalizations are a shame, and do nothing but reinforce the most negative stereotypes that women have against men. In fact, what the world needs less of is exactly what your peddling: anger and hate.
You certainly haven’t done your homework about the the statutes in each state – or are purposely ignorant of them. Your statement that, “The one thing I can say, with all sincerity, is that child support guidelines are fair.” illustrates this perfectly because they can differ dramatically from state to state. Did you feel that your ex husband paying 13% for multiple kids was fair? Doesn’t sound like you were happy about! In my state (Illinois) the amount would be 20%, plus another 8% for each kid. Is that fair? Its over double what you were receiving. Would 28% be fair if the father’s income was half the income of the mother? What if the latter was true, and the father was also paying for daycare, etc?
Most non custodial parents pay more than13% of their income on child support. In MA the guidelines mean 17-25% is the norm, before extra expenses are added.
True,
In NH 25% for 1 child. Plus healthcare and out of pocket expenses ect. And that is of gross income. But what I find to be the real problem is that it is taken out of your gross income, but you still have to include that money on your tax return. So you are essentially paying taxes on money that someone else gets. I also think that Judges should look at distribution of debt as well. If the non custodial parent gets saddled with most of the debt from the marriage, then child support should reflect that, but in NH it is automatically 25% they don’t take anything else into account. Seems wrong. My wife made about 20,000 less than me and in the divorce I was made to be responsible for most of the debt due to the fact that my income was higher. She got to leave with barely $150 a month in credit debt while my portion is around $800.00. Even though she is the one who had the affair and left me. So, even though my income is higher, my out of pocket expenses are much higher as well. The system seems unfair.
It isnt the amount we pay??? You have no clue lady. Sorry you have a hateful relationship with your ex. Not sure why you think everyone elses situation is the same as yours?
Children do not cost this much. You would have rent, food, electric or any other utility even if you don’t have kids. Unless your homless. Or live at home. This is ludicrous to be included. I pay 1000 dollars a month for three kids. Guess how much I make a month right now maybe 1200. How am I to pay rent so that my kids can see me. Or have any sorta of job. Bc I need to pay car insurance to have a car. I need a car for a job. So explain to me how this works? Bunch selfish ppl. Peace.
@Joe – Right, except if the man remarries or gets a new common law partner their “household” income is counted with regard to support but when SHE remarries or cohabits with a new MAN, his income (their household income) is NOT! Equality? Not even close. Women have every advantage going into relationships, and single moms are the single worst liability for any man. (Read up on step-parent support and be forewarned). It’s important to say NO to single moms so that the existing insane laws are revised.
Plain and simple … if life is better without the man, then get divorced and move on. if you need or feel entitled to his money, then stay. He should not have to continue paying for your decisions to leave. Grow up. Move on. If you don’t need him as your spouse, then get along without him. Seriously.
Most states are income sharing with no limits. In PA for example, if I the father make 70k a year and the mother makes 10k a year, it is a combined income of 80k each and divided evenly between the parents. So the father is forced to pay the 30k difference a year. This exists even WITH joint custody (50 50). Thats were the system is flawed.
The father is forced to pay roughly 40% of his earnings in child support.
You are absolutely incorrect about no man going broke. I pay child support and never complain. I can manage. However a coworker loses over 50 percent of his income. And has a new child with another woman. he can barely pay his own rent nevermind the extra a child demands. Youre 100 percent right the system is flawed. It should be based on a max 40 hour week and not gross income but net.. since thats realistically what we take home.. you wouldnt have access to the gross income even if you werent booted outof his life for being so retarded
trev, if your friend is paying over 50% of his salary in child support that means he is paying arrears, along with his regular child support. Why should laws be reformed because he chose, at some point, not to pay support. And he has a new child? Who makes the choice to have a child they can’t afford? Are his previous children supposed to do without so he can raise another one? His decision to have a child when he couldn’t afford one was flawed. In his case, the system isn’t the problem, his life choices are.
No Cathy, the states can take 55% of your income and 65% if you are in arrears. I really think you need to do more research. And thats net that they take, but they base what they take out of our net based on our gross? If you bring home 1000/month, you can easily pay 550 to 650/month in child support. Also, how dare you say he made bad life choices because he decided to have another kid with another women in a new relationship? So you are insinuating that since he pays child support, he is not allowed to have another child? The mother collecting his support can have another child, why can’t he? You are apparently very jaded. There are many women making bad “life choices” in deciding to continue to bear children lots of children to collect support, and do you know why? Because its profitable for the mothers when this system rewards you hands down for having kids. You can wake up one morning, say to your husband or bf that you don’t want this to work anymore, no matter what the issue is and the father is automatically punished.
How do you know he “chose not to pay” Child support regularly? How do you know he didnt lose his job at one point and struggled to find another job? All the while, the CS debt just got larger and larger. People like you are what is wrong with this system and country! Are there people who go around making 10 kids they cant afford? SURE there are idiots but not every is the same! Someone people just don’t have 6 figure bank accounts and simply choose not to pay. Idiot.
@Greg:
Yes Greg, and note that if YOU get a partner, your HOUSEHOLD income is counted for support, but with the ex, only HER income is looked at and not the additional income HER new partner provides! So much for equality! Women are not even close to being equal to men because of insane rules like this. Totally biased against men. Another trick women use is to get a new partner but LIE about their common law arrangement. They pretend to be destitute mothers where as a couple, they are doing far better than the biological father who they (as a couple) are fleecing. This kind of thing should be illegal and severely punished. It’s basically child support fraud, but women are never held accountable in these matters. Equality? Not even close.
Very likely one of the most mis informed articles I have ever read. I also noticed that the reference to who was paying child support was always “the father”. This feminist BS is exactly what the problem is. Phyllis Shafly was right on becuase unless that person is accountable for the expenditure of money they do not earn that is supposed to be for the children that is what it becomes. CS should be on a debit card with a trackable invoice that can be called into court for accounting at anytime.
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This article was painful to read. I cant believe an author can be that angry towards men, yet be a “relationship coach”?
Every part of this was a finger pointing session and could quite well relate to her own experience in divorce. This article lacked any real research, objective or critical thinking.
If a dad only wants his kids every other weekend and once a week for an evening. Okay fine, CS is very very.
To be automatically placed on that end, with the courts and laws against you is rediculous. It should be defacto that if both parents want custody they are given equal time. A time with a father is far more important than his money.
Even with every other weekend and one evening a week, if you count that the kids are in school and sleep, I have my kids about 40% of the time. I have to buy beds, provide food, take the to have fun. But I pay her half of what it takes to supposedly care for them. The ACA gives them free health care, and they eat at school.
I am going to fight for more time, its an uphill battle. But no father should be reduced to a part time dad and a paycheck if he is willing to care for his children.
Period.
Oh and for the record, I am broke. I live on a strict budget and its the only way I get by.
And yes, she has a brand new car, moved out of the house I left her and into a new house while being able to rent the old one out. This is because I paid all the bill during the relationship and she rat holed her money and had a lot of savings. We never got married so I couldn’t get any. Yeah I am stupid for that. But when we were together even with me paying the bills I always had money, and I was young and at one point fairly happy.
You know hte kicker, since she rents the home for $1200 a month(taking home about $500 after the mortgage) it counts towards her income and raises my CS payments. Where is the logic in that, she makes more so I have to pay more…
And if I get a part time job, which I am looking at doing because I am tired of being broke, guess what. MY CHILD SUPPORT GOES UP. By me doing what I have to do to survive, I am penalized even more.
I am the better parent. My kids already talk about how their mom gets too angry too fast(Why I ended up splitting), and I say nothing but good things about her to them. Even though she badmouths me all the time to them. That’s fine, the kids already see though it, but I have to fight to prove I am a good dad like I am some sort of criminal while she is awarded just for being the women. That is simply wrong.
The reason for child support in general is dated. For many households the days of one working parent are gone and the earning potential for both parents is near equal. The problem is that child support isn’t proportional to the needs of a child. It is unfortunate the child support even exists as it should just be the parents known responsibility to provide for child. However, because there are irresponsible people we again let the governement state what it thinks is fair. However since governements are based on common law the change in which law happens compared to society is lagging. That is why many are mad a child support guidlines.
I have no issue with paying support for my (2) children. What I take issue with is being on the hook for up to 18 years of child support because I may choose to cohabit with a woman with kids for a year or two. If she leaves me, she should go back to working with the OTHER biological parent to ensure THEIR children have what they need. Imagine if I have two or three relationships not work out, and because I’m a single dad, I only (can) date single moms? Every couple of years, pick up another couple of kids to pay support for? Sorry single moms. Can’t afford to pay for your kids – already got my own to pay for. I warn all men to AVOID SINGLE MOMS at all cost unless they are 100% okay with step-parent support. Also note that if she reduces her income (like when she cohabits with her next partner and avoids reporting she is common law) the list of “previous suckers” will get a nice recalculation letter in the mail. Sorry, but due to feminism the females who are natural born parasites are thriving at the expense of men. Equality? Nope. Not even close until these rules are revised!
“Many single mothers receive public assistance when they dont receive child support.” GEE maybe they should receive JOBS instead then! Turning this issue into a gender issue is false and comical. Anyone who actually been through the system knows how much of a nightmare it is and its a non stop extortion ring justified by, of course, using the children. There are soo many women who are also noncustodial parents and they get robbed just like men do. This is not just about money but also the unconstituional practice of sending people to JAIL without due proceess. In 2006, the NJ supreme court ruled that parents facing jail time for nonpayment of support ARE entitled to lawyers!( Pasqua v Council) That lawsuit was brought by a WOMAN! There is so much abuse and corruption in this broken system we desperately need reform. All we are doing are futher tearing apart families instead of working to keep BOTH parents cooperative for the child sake! This is more like a system built on revenge because the one parents didnt want the other parent anymore! You cannot punish people for their choices on who to be with and use their children as a reason to do it! Its disgusting! I urge people to contact their local state senators and urge child support reform on a local level! Its 2015 now! Tell those lazy custodial parents to get a paying job! A good parents raises a child AND provides for them too!
Please help this mother who was jailed by an unjust court system after losing her daughter for 13 years. https://www.gofundme.com/rippyhouse
sue why if the father is paying his child support and health insurance as required and i may add dont have a problem with this why is it ok for the mother to work a full time job and recieve food stamps wic medicare and free health insurance for herself and every time gets her panties in a bunch goes back to court i mean how is this even fair this is her child to but she just thinks she deserves a free ride and the courts allow this????????
It is an eye opener to go through the divorce and child custodysupport processes here in Washington. The system is completely broke. I was almost the soul caregiver ‘father’ to my two children and when I went for a divorce because exy had an affair with a coworker on her graveyard shift, she simply quit her job and gained custody, support and maintenance! There was no ‘best interest of the children’ involved just merely winning. I see my kids a.m.a.p. but having to pay her to entertain them on her time is SO wrong. Support should be a minimum amount for bare necessities, not to keep another household held to the highest standards. Shouldn’t it be as important for my children to have what they need here w me as it is for her in her household?!? 5050 custody w minimum support should be the bar. Fathers are labeled as support checks and nothing more- all to the detriment of their children!
.
listen up missy. What if the mom refuses to care for the kids ONE BIT, the father does EVERYTHING and he STILL has to pay full table amounts of child support? What if the MOM was the one who left the father? What if the mom used her child support to buy a house, a car and like 500 spa appointments because she DIDNT WANT TO GET A JOB?? This is what happened with my parents. I may be young, but i know enough. Dang prejudices. Its not the fifties anymore, ladies! Men can be parents too and women can go to a full time job. Its the 21st century. Dont be biased. Move on.
You are a man hater period the end! You say men are dicks to these poor women that cant do anything but raise children yet you are talking out your butt! I pay child support to my youngest child because i lost custody when they looked at my work schduel. YET I AM RAISING MY 9 YEAR OLD DAUGHTER ON JUST MY INCOME! The mother to my oldest does not have to pay because she has a virgina so she is a victim. On the other hand the mother to my second daughter gets 500 a month plus my daughter is covered under my heathcare. after everything is takin out its hard to even live let alone have chrismas for my oldest. So before you run your mouth about how these poor victim mothers need child support how about you look at the whole picture!
You do realize that child support laws have barely changed in the 40 year since they were established. Using the housewife and bread maker rule which isn’t the way anymore. I feel it should be 50/50 all the way. It geared way to much to mothers. N if I remember right women fought for rights to be on the same footing as men not above..
Offensive propaganda.Misandrist,entitlement,i want to live off the system if father cant pay feminist circular.
Seig heil fascists.
Sisters of the brownshirt.
Lady you are a lunatic
As I have written before, Cathy is a misandrist and HORRIBLY misinformed about the child support process from the man’s perspective. It is a TRAVESTY that this web site gives this woman a forum to spew her disgusting hatred of anyone who opposes her viewpoint. Cathy, we all know what you are, and no one respects you. Go live in misery and hatred as you have done for many years.
This sickening to read my exwife doesnt work and collects 187.64 a week and leaves me with 207.00 a week to live on and peovude for my kids when I do have them. This is a sexist womens rights webpage obviously. If half the mothers that collect ungodly amounts of support gave a ***it about their children they would want the fathers of their children to provide for them as well. I guarantee children only go without when they go to dads house because he has no money because the greedy mother gets a good portiin of it
Amen
1
Most self centered article I have ever read. This is a case by case opinionated article. I know a guy who is active 50/50 with his children but by the time child support is subtracted from his pay checks, he makes $200 bi weekly take home. How does anyone live off of $400 a month? How can you ou rent or mortgage, clothe yourself and eat for that kind of money? The system is pathetic.
i have my children half the time joint cuistody, i have recently lost income of 2000 dollars per month.
.Our friend of the court came back with a new calculation and it only goes down 30 dolllars, so it does change at least 10% so it does not change at all. How fair is this? It isnt it is s a corrupt system. Maybe more birth control and morals should be taught as part of the reform.
One of the issues that need to be dealt with, whether we call it a reform or improvement is spouses who can, but don’t pay child support. If we are better at enforcing support payments, we can also be better at handling various unexpected circumstances (such as a parent losing their job and truly needs help with the payments.) $100 billion is a lot of money with a lot of impact on families.
“After years of surviving on minimal child support and working with both mothers and fathers during and after divorce, I don’t see this as a clear case of injustice and inequality against fathers, the parent who is more likely to be ordered to pay child support. In fact I don’t think that a sense of “injustice and inequality” have anything to do with fathers who resent paying child support. “
So wait….because of ur personal experience, everyones else personal experience is discredited?
Oh boy…this article. I pay 66% of the parenting plan for my 6 year old daughter. Get her every other weekend and Wednesday night for dinner. 653 a month…for a six year old. I have no problem paying support. I took her to court to get what rights I have. But why should I to pay 66% vs her 33%..she gets the tax benefits, doesn’t share, won’t share. It’s wrong. I’m sorry you had a bad experience.
Matthew, this article is far worse than an “Oh Boy”. You think $653 a month is fair. Try that with 4 kids with two exes. It’s called bankruptcy. The lawyers who wrote these laws can do math. Why they chose not to is obvious – the more conflict, the more work for lawyers.
I am raising my daughter all by myself. Her Dad is choosing not to be involved in her life. I have gone thru the court sytem to collect child support for her and I am still waiting to received $55 a week from him. He is working under the table so nothing can be taken from what he makes. I struggle everyday trying to provide for my daughter. I belive there should be stiffer laws for the dead beat dads that refuse to pay, not the ones who do pay. I appauld the dads who take care of their child. It takes two people to make a child and both parents should do their part in taking care of the child/children.
I was a single mother for the entire time I raised my son, who NEVER saw his father, this Father NEVER supported his child. I fully understand if the father has nothing to do with the children but if the father is putting his fair share in and has to compensate for the mothers ineptness then is this fair I ask? NOOOO hasn’t this man suffered enough? He’s a grearter father than his own is so many ways than one and should not be punished for it. He wants to pay for his sons needs which his does when he has him but if custody is 50/50 than the mother by any means neccesary should be responsible for her 50%. WTHHHHHHH
Amen!!!
Cathy, you are a simpleton at best – you seemingly disregard so many complexities.
If you are such a great mom, take care of and provide for your own kid instead of financially raping someone that doesn’t want to be in a relationship with you! You are not owed anything. You should have dedicated yourself to education and progress to find a better job instead of thinking someone needs to work for and answer to you. You women are sickening.
No, us women aren’t owed anything. The children we have with men are owed something, though. Whether that man is still in a relationship with the mother of his children or not, he is still partly financially responsible for HIS children. You see, loving and providing for a child doesn’t end the moment the relationship ends. Of course, people with a moral compass understand that concept. Especially us sickening women who are raising children that some man abandoned emotionally and financially.
The Illinois divorce courts are corrupted. The do not care about the father feelings, stability, and the child. The lawyers are all in volved with the judge in getting you to pay their fees and the of course the mothers. I have a 19 teen year old and a 17 teen old daughter who disrespectful me, does not call me, or care to see me regardless that I’v been paying child support. The mothers alienated my kids, lie to our children to keep them in control. It’s been three years since I seen them and the court system has done nothing for my peace of mind regarding our relationships. I feel like ATM dummy. These mothers do not even care and they use the support to get they’re nails done and go off on expensive trips with their new lovers. My x did that and abandon my daughter for six months. Broke all the rules in the divorce decree and came back to United States, fought me in court pro bono while I paid $15000 to a lawyer who lost my case and my teenage daughter returned back to her mom and has not called me since. Sociopath sickening women abusing dad’s when ever it’s convenient. It should be a reform for that especially if the mother is part of the problem destroying the fathers relationship with the child. When they get older they hold grudges on us, not realizing the system has been bias to our rights and the mothers our to blame for desensitizing the relationship. I’m broke financially and I’m broken in my heart. I have to pay for lawyer to get my kids to me. B.S
The Illinois divorce courts are corrupted. The do not care about the father feelings, stability, and the child. The lawyers are all in volved with the judge in getting you to pay their fees and the of course the mothers. I have a 19 teen year old and a 17 teen old daughter who disrespectful me, does not call me, or care to see me regardless that I’v been paying child support. The mothers alienated my kids, lie to our children to keep them in control. It’s been three years since I seen them and the court system has done nothing for my peace of mind regarding our relationships. I feel like ATM dummy. These mothers do not even care and they use the support to get they’re nails done and go off on expensive trips with their new lovers. My x did that and abandon my daughter for six months. Broke all the rules in the divorce decree and came back to United States, fought me in court pro bono while I paid $15000 to a lawyer who lost my case and my teenage daughter returned back to her mom and has not called me since. Sociopath sickening women abusing dad’s when ever it’s convenient. It should be a reform for that especially if the mother is part of the problem destroying the fathers relationship with the child. When they get older they hold grudges on us, not realizing the system has been bias to our rights and the mothers our to blame for desensitizing the relationship. I’m broke financially and I’m broken in my heart. I have to pay for lawyer to get my kids to me. B.S
The Illinois divorce courts are corrupted. The do not care about the father feelings, stability, and the child. The lawyers are all in volved with the judge in getting you to pay their fees and the of course the mothers. I have a 19 teen year old and a 17 teen old daughter who disrespectful me, does not call me, or care to see me regardless that I’v been paying child support. The mothers alienated my kids, lie to our children to keep them in control. It’s been three years since I seen them and the court system has done nothing for my peace of mind regarding our relationships. I feel like ATM dummy. These mothers do not even care and they use the support to get they’re nails done and go off on expensive trips with their new lovers. My x did that and abandon my daughter for six months. Broke all the rules in the divorce decree and came back to United States, fought me in court pro bono while I paid $15000 to a lawyer who lost my case and my teenage daughter returned back to her mom and has not called me since. Sociopath sickening women abusing dad’s when ever it’s convenient. It should be a reform for that especially if the mother is part of the problem destroying the fathers relationship with the child. When they get older they hold grudges on us, not realizing the system has been bias to our rights and the mothers our to blame for desensitizing the relationship. I’m broke financially and I’m broken in my heart. I have to pay for lawyer to get my kids to me. B.S
My ex has a well paying job and I pay over 2 grand a month and am left with 500 dollars every two weeks. I pay my child support every paycheck and take my children every opportunity I can. Tell me how 500 dollars is supposed to last me every two weeks in NY and then I’m responsible for another 900 in child care. So how is it that im not going broke from my payments when I take home total 100 dollars a month. Legitimately. The system screws the fathers who do the right thing.
John, I find what you are saying hard to believe. New York uses the income shares model for deciding child support. Your wife’s income would have been taken into consideration when coming up with the amount of child support that was to be paid. Unless you both have very low paying jobs, with hers paying lower than yours, there is no way you should be left with only $500 every two weeks. If that is the case, I don’t imagine, with her low paying job and her responsibility of housing and feeding the children that she is much better off than you at the end of the month.
You completely ignore the facts and refuse to acknowledge that good fathers exists that want to financially care for their children. I do believe you are a bitter woman that use the courtt take advantage of your ex.
I’m sorry Cathy but there isn’t enough information to say that this isn’t true. Child support is a percentage of gross income, and after taxes I am left with practically nothing. I take my son 3 to 4 days a week but still have to pay the full amount in support. Meanwhile she bounces from job to job and lives off my paycheck. Even with 50/50 custody the higher earner has to pay the lower earner. That is absurd! And then the best one is at the end of the year she claims him on her taxes and gets a truck load with earned income credit. The system is seriously flawed and allows for no adjustments for fathers that actually see their children often. If I have my son for 3-4 days a week why should I have to pay her bills for the whole week? If she wants a better lifestyle she should earn it like I have to!
She is a city school teacher and if you don’t believe me I’ll send you a photo of my paycheck
This article is a joke man goes broke, n it isn’t always is his fault
I realize that I’m late to the party, but her goes.
I WANT to use a special purpose checking account like this one (http://www.mediate.com/articles/if_they_can_do_parenting_plans.cfm) so that my ex-wife and I can share the responsibility for providing for our children’s needs, buy my family court judge refuses because “Your [voluntarily unemployed ex-]wife deserves that money (referring to ‘child support’).
I also learned from a lawyer that states collect kickbacks (incentive payments) under the Child Support Performance and Incentive Act for both ordering sole custody with the lower earning parent and for restricting a non-custodial parents access to their children because doing so increases the gross amount of child support collected, which then increases the kickbacks that the state receives from the federal government.
This profit motive also explains why states charge illegal amounts of intrerest on child support arrears that violate 42 US Code 654(21)(a) and why the Bradley Amendment (42 US Code 666 – somehow appropriate) prevents a state from modifying child support already ordered, even if a DNA test proves that you’re not the father!
If you can’t pay try setting up a crowd funding site: https://www.youcaring.com/greg-partin-598665
You’re way off base here. I agree that child support is a good thing. I won’t argue there. Where I will argue is the amount. For example, my husband pays $1400 a month in child support for 2 kids! That’s $700 a child a month. Are kids really that expensive? NO! He has a little more than the minimum custody, but not much. How does someone need that much in child support!? His ex is remarried to someone who makes a decent living. He makes more than enough to support his “family” and then some. Now add to that another $1400 a month. They have no house payment. They have no car payment. They live a great life, while we basically pay two mortgages. It’s not fair. My husband is a great father. He has always been there and always will be. He’s not a dead-beat. It’s those types of fathers who give the good ones a bad reputation. So don’t make your blanket statements regarding child support and all fathers. The system for sure takes advantage of the fathers. And you’re right. There is no way to prove the money actually goes to the child. That’s a valid argument! It’s child support! That’s where it’s suppose to go! There should be a discovery process that ensures the money is going towards the child. That’s the point! Your article needs more research and openmindness to the other side. You obviously don’t live it, so it’s not happening in your back yard. Have the roles switched and come better prepared to argue something you clearly know very little about.
Yeah this article seems a little one sided. I just got hit with child support and she’s asking for $1373 a month for son and daughter. I’ve never steer from my financial responsibility at all. Daycare got it. Sports got it. School clothes and school supplies done. I got behind on the daycare trying to help pay for everything else so I was able to work something out with the daycare provider. So I’m paying her back pay of 800 a month which is the normal rate, when their mom decided she wanted to change daycares. The new daycare is 800 a month as well and she wanted me to pay both. $1600? In just daycare? So asked her could she at least pay half on the new one, I’ll eat the other and pay 1200. She wasnt ok with that so now I’m in this mess. Isn’t wrong for me to asks her to pay her half. I mean she wants to claim my son, why not paid for him then. I’m still paying my half plus the other 800. At some point you have to admit there are some women out there abusing the system. But not us fathers are bad guys. I’m proud to be called Daddy. And I accept the challenges. But her taking me for child support has nothing to do with the children and everything to do with me asking her to paid her half. And that’s petty. No other way around it. Not to mention were still married and she has a boyfriend who lives with and they have a son together and not only are my kids on my medical, which they should be, but so is she.
If this article is written from a perspective of fathers who don’t pay, then I will agree.
I am a father that pays a good amount, pays it on time, and pays it gladly because it is to go to the support of my beloved children.
Only one problem. Their mother remarried, quit her job because she is, frankly, lazy, and thinks I need to pay half of things that I’m not required to pay. Thing is, I’ve done the calculation on what it would cost to feed my kids, cloth them with GOOD clothes, school expenses, extra curricular activities, AND even allowing for a small portion for their part of utilities and mortgage. And with what I pay, it can cover ALL of those needs with NO need by my ex-wife to use their household income for their care.
But she doesn’t get the fact that my child support, even though well covers their expenses, is MY contribution to their expenses. Its not meant to cover it all, even though it does.
So while you are correct that it sticks in alot of men’s gut that they have to pay this money to the ex-wife realizing that she wants to use some of that money for her own wants, it doesn’t change the fact that there are too many mothers that want more support so they can pocket some of it for those who have baby daddies that pay a good amount in support.
Like one article I read, maybe it wouldn’t be that way if instead of the scenario I posted above, that mother’s would recognize that, for those of us that pay, pay on time, and pay alot, that the money is enough for their needs and there is NO financial burden to her to take care of them……a thank you might make the difference instead of using us as a bank an their own personal income.
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You just made me gag with how poorly you understand the subject and how biased you are in favor of one parent over the other. Do a little research on the subject before spreading your dogma
I think child support system is fine if the guy pays his support order when its due because the mom wants the support then there will be no arrears tacked on to the bill where men getting 50-60% of there net taken cry like babies. I do think retro arrears need to be removed in this example. Lets say a man finds out he has a 15 year old son by a woman he was with 15 years ago. He never knew he had a child with this woman. the woman decides hmm I want to get child support from my kids dad now because she’s having a hard time or what ever. They do a DNA test and now he has 15 years in arrears to pay for a kid he never even knew about. To me this is super unfair, that support should only go from now until 18 now from birth to 15 in arrears.
The jail and removing rights to have a license etc are fine these scare tactics keep the professional men in check as they don’t want to have any problems like this that would keep them from making good money for any real job. only low pay jobs will allow someone with a record to work for them for example.
I have a support order and have been sending willing direct deposits to my ex wife’s bank account 1/3 of my net income. Do I like paying this? Heck no I don’t! But at the end of the day she only gets 33% of my net for a short time then its over with like a car loan. Prior to moving out and leaving her she was spending 100% of my net income and we lived paycheck to paycheck on just my income for 12 years while she played house. So I will happily take the 67% I actually see and get to do great things with that were never possible before. The positives outweigh the negatives here I am not in a crappy unhappy marriage and I don’t have to answer to no one. MGTOW approved 🙂
MAYBE THEY SHOULDN’T HAVE KIDS IF THEY CAN’T AFFORD THEM. AND IF IT WAS A CASE OF DIVORCE, THEN MAYBE WHAT THE GOVERNMENT SHOULD DO IS EDUCATE AND EMPLOY THESE WOMEN AND EMPOWER THEM TO NEVER HAVE TO RELY ON ANYONE TO FINANCIALLY CARE FOR THEIR CHILDREN. YOU ACT LIKE WOMEN ARE TOO INCAPABLE TO EVEN SUPPORT THEMSELVES. GUESS WHAT? IT’S IGNORACE LIKE THAT, THAT KEEPS THIS BROKEN, ONE SIDED SYSTEM IN PLACE.
Empower women to financially care for their children? Those are also HIS children!!!!! Child support is a drop in the bucket compared to the cost of actually raising a child. Divorced Women are already doing the lion’s share of financially taking care of their children. Who the hell are you to dismiss the reality of what those women already do. They are already EMPOWERED! They are EMPOWERED enough to know that their children rightfully deserve to also be taken care of financially by their fathers.
that one line is all you can focus on? did you miss the part where he said all his child support goes to the kid? what is he supposed to live on? you sound to me, like you are just a bitter, hateful, ignorant, man hating, feminist with a chip on your shoulder because your husband left you.
And you are a man using a woman’s name to leave a scathing comment. Coward!!
Biggest issue with child support is that most states don’t sufficiently factor in the noncustodial parent’s expenses.
Most states use the “income shares” approach, where assumes a child is entitled to the same share of their parents’ combined incomes regardless of their marital status.
Here’s the problem–many states insist on arbitrarily-chosen “parenting time” thresholds before ANY presumptive reduction in child support is granted to the non-custodial parent. Below that threshold, it is a *legal presumption* that a father directly incurring child-related expenses still owes the same as a completely absent, derelict parent.
This is a bad economic and bad legal policy. BOTH parents have a duty of support, but with most states, the NCP has the duty to support the kids when they’re with the custodial parent, but the custodial parent has NO corresponding duty of support to the NCP when the children are under the NCP’s roof.
A child is entitled to support from BOTH parents. The child support payment should be adjusted accordingly to account for the distribution of both the expenses and the incomes. Most states do not do this, and have shown complete indifference to noncustodial parents, mostly fathers.
Here’s an example of bad child support policy–in Illinois, the legal presumption is a non-custodial parent owes the FULL “guideline” support an absent, derelict parent does if they have up to 145 annual overnights. Child support is for the children; that is not debatable. But any parent who’s got their kids under their care 39% of the time is CLEARLY incurring SIGNIFICANT child-related expenses, both in terms of providing for the extra bedroom(s) for the child(ren), food, transportation, entertainment, etc.
That threshold varies state-by-state. It’s 25% of the overnights in OH, MD, CO and VA, 35% in WV, 40% in PA and IL, and 49% (?!) in SD. Some states have NO timesharing adjustment (I’m looking at you, Alabama) where you could pay full guideline support even at 50/50.
If the lesser-time parent’s directly-incurred child-related expenses aren’t properly recognized, it’s not child support. It’s custodial support.
Child support is based on the idea the child deserves the same share of the parents’ combined incomes regardless of their marital status. But it ignores separated parents needing *TWO* sets of fixed housing expenses while intact families need just *ONE*.
Child support has driven many obligors–particularly low-income fathers–into poverty for tasking them with solving a math problem that policy makers KNOW can’t be solved. If both parent living together were just above the poverty line, they will both be below the poverty line apart. The child support order merely lessens the burden on one (custodial) parent while crushing the other in grinding poverty. Tacit admission of this is seen in recent federal regulations that call for states to have self-support reserves (SSR) to reduce the obligor’s chances of impoverishment by judicial decree.